Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rpi!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!hsdndev!cmcl2!kramden.acf.nyu.edu!brnstnd
From: brnstnd@kramden.acf.nyu.edu (Dan Bernstein)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.admin
Subject: Re: IRC and Security
Message-ID: <28058:Apr420:20:3991@kramden.acf.nyu.edu>
Date: 4 Apr 91 20:20:39 GMT
References: <1991Mar13.232433.3162@athena.mit.edu> <5077:Mar1805:03:4491@kramden.acf.nyu.edu> <1991Mar21.162220.15612@sci34hub.sci.com>
Organization: IR
Lines: 60

In article <1991Mar21.162220.15612@sci34hub.sci.com> gary@sci34hub.sci.com (Gary Heston) writes:
> I suggest you go learn the difference between "illegal" and "improper".

Sure thing. Sending commercial packets over NSFNET, for example, is
improper. Sending commercial packets over NYU-NET is (as far as I know)
illegal.

> Using some of the academic networks for things like newsfeeds would be
> outside the guidelines established for those networks, and therefore
> improper.

Does NYU-NET have guidelines? I sure don't remember seeing any. But NYU
gets a lot of money from the Department of Education, I believe some of
that money helps pay for NYU-NET, so any use of NYU-NET must *by law*
contribute to instruction or research.

> It's not, however, a violation of any law, and describing
> it as "illegal" is incorrect and makes you look sensationalist rather
> than having a legitimate argument. 

I wish that were true.

> Did you post your article over an acedemic network? If so, why? It's
> not research, and therefore, by your own characterizations, it was
> illegal.

(Note that it's ``instruction and research,'' not just ``research.'')
The courts don't blink an eye at administrative use of Education
Department money. How do you think NYU---a billion-dollar-a-year,
non-profit company---would keep running if it didn't have management?
Administration? (Janitors? :-))

I feel confident that a court would accept this argument: my article is
directly intended to lessen the amount of traffic, present and future,
that might be (illegally, btw) carried by NYU-NET, and hence to
contribute to the better use of our network money for instruction and
research.

Similarly, IRC---as an experiment in networking---can easily be seen as
contributing to instruction and research. But what about IRC, the
chit-chat line? IRC, where people spend a lot of time exchanging
information with no apparent relevance to anything academic? How do you
justify such use?

> "Illegal" behavior is that which directly violates LAW, not school
> rules (or NSF guidelines).

'Zactly.

> Sending a note to someone across country
> that you'll drop by for a visit next week isn't illegal. Giving
> several people the password to you account isn't illegal. FTPing a
> GIF image of Garfield to someone isn't illegal.

Respectively: Yes, it is, unless that note contributes to instruction
and/or research. Yes, it is, unless those people's uses of your account
contribute to instruction and research. And yes, it is, copyright law
aside, unless the recipient is taking a course in cartooning.

---Dan