Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rpi!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!linac!att!rutgers!ucsd!nic.cerf.net!benseb From: benseb@nic.cerf.net (Booker Bense) Newsgroups: comp.sys.next Subject: Re: RISC vs. CISC -- SPECmarks Keywords: MIPS are MEANINGLESS Message-ID: <339@nic.cerf.net> Date: 19 Apr 91 15:17:01 GMT References: <8lbG1vdl1@cs.psu.edu> <1991Apr18.180538.1@sif.claremont.edu> Organization: San Diego Supercomputer Center @ UCSD Lines: 48 In article <1991Apr18.180538.1@sif.claremont.edu> greg@sif.claremont.edu (Tigger) writes: >In article , melling@cs.psu.edu (Michael D Mellinger) writes: >> >> In article <1991Apr17.192605.1@sif.claremont.edu> greg@sif.claremont.edu (Tigger) writes: [ Stuff about Super Computers Deleted ] > >> Anyway, NeXT needs a near term solution to the price/performane rat >> race, and RISC is currently blowing the doors off of CISC. > >I would tend to disagree. I have a benchmark that I run periodically >when I have the chance to get my hands on a new machine with a C compiler. >The VAX 9000 and the NeXT '040 are two of the three fastest machines that >I've had a chance to test. Both are CISC designs. Both outperformed systems >based on the two most widespread RISC designs, MIPS and SPARC. The only >RISC chip that was in the same league was RIOS, and then only when the >compiler's optimization was turned on to insure superscalar >operation. - Getting performance out of the machine depends on alot more than MIPS or even MFLOPS. The whole system has to be balanced, ie if you have a fast chip , you have to have a fast disk , fast memory ,etc... The only real test of a machine is to take code that you use and run it. I work with some of these ``RISC'' monsters ( DECstation 5000, Sparc ) and they run benchmarks great, but getting any real complex code running is painful. Most benchmarks do all their work in loops small enough to reside in the instruction buffer. This is what makes those numbers so spiffy and performance degrade so fast when you start having to load/ unload instruction buffers. I haven't played with my NeXT enough yet to get a feel for how well balanced it is. One thing I am truly impressed with is the speed of it's graphics. Complex real time animation is possible, this is not true of the SparcStation 1 on my desk. Granted the Sparcstation has color and is suffering under the burden of attempting to animate in X11 %-)!. ( Before the flames start I like X11, but the support for animation is minimal ). > [ Rational arguement about merging of RISC CISC designs deleted ] - So in conclusion what you really need to measure is price/(performance doing what I do ) -BWT , the software that comes with the NeXT is worth the price of the computer alone. When you consider the price / performance ratio you should consider platforms with the same software configuration. - Booker C. Bense prefered: benseb@grumpy.sdsc.edu "I think it's GOOD that everyone NeXT Mail: benseb@next.sdsc.edu becomes food " - Hobbes