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From: japlady@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Rebecca Radnor)
Newsgroups: soc.religion.eastern
Subject: doctrine and practice in the zen tradition "eat when hungry..."
Message-ID: <1991Apr22.193035.5837@nas.nasa.gov>
Date: 22 Apr 91 19:30:35 GMT
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Organization: Northwestern University
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In response to the question concerning the zen saying, "when hungry eat,
when tired sleep"; I think the the moi   most important issue here is not
finding some rationalyzation for zen 'philosophy' but the state of mind of
the inquirer.  Most of our thinking is dualistic in nature (actually all of
it) and this includes our questions about why this and why that.  Of what
concern is it of anybodies anybody's that some zen master said one thing or
another? This is just grasping at words.  A more important question is "am
I identifying with any tradition, and why is there this identification?"
Of course we "identify" because of a basic need for foundations.  And this
arises because of the insecurity of the 'self' thaty  is thrown into an
alienatiing world.  All of this presupposes that there is a self and other
relationship.  So, instead of asking why sit or someone said such and such,
you might want to investigate your own presuppositions, i.e., what you are
attached to and why.  Are you assuming a 'you' that has a reality above and
beyond conventional dic   discourse?  
Of course, our famous zen masters would say I am attached to philosophyzing
and this might be true.  A better 'answer ' might be "just sit for
sitting's sake."  
As for your answer to your question I think is  it is a good one in terms
of explaining the relationship between zen doctrine and zen practice.
However, when doctrine and practice are 'two' we are still operating on the
plane of ordinary life (as 'opposed to ultimate truth'?  The Buddhists say
when ultimate truth is realized there is no dual relationship between
ordinary and ultimate).  
So if you're hungry right now ah have something to eat.

(I'm using a girlfriend's (my roommate) account.
My name is J. Cha grad student of Buddhist Philosophy at N.U.
If you respond to japlady's account I will receive it.
My true interest <and topic of study> is Nagarjuna's Madhyamika philosophy
<and for you specialists, the Prasanga tradition of Candrakirti>.