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From: cl@lgc.com (Cameron Laird)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.french,trial.soc.culture.italian,soc.history,soc.misc
Subject: Re: May Day
Message-ID: <1991May6.184704.19983@lgc.com>
Date: 6 May 91 18:47:04 GMT
References: <1991May2.141435.4390@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> <1991May2.180348.21097@lgc.com> <1991May2.191553.12139@noose.ecn.purdue.edu>
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In article <1991May2.191553.12139@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> giacomet@haley.ecn.purdue.edu (  ) writes:
>In article <1991May2.180348.21097@lgc.com> cl@lgc.com (Cameron Laird) writes:
>>In article <1991May2.141435.4390@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> giacomet@haley.ecn.purdue.edu (  ) writes:
>>			.
>>			.
>>			.
>>> La chose bizare est que, si vous allez a` Chicago, toute trace, ou
>>>meme reference a` cet evenement a disparu. Meme le nom de la place
>>>et les rues ont change'; cela s'etait passe' vers le bas de Michigan.
>>>Meme pas une plaque, et la plupart des habitants de Chicago ne connaissent
>>>pas l'evenement non plus. Un bel exemple d'escamotage historique a` mon
>>>avis. C'est vrai que, au jour ou` les "heritage" and "rememberance" days
>>>sont a` la mode aux E.U., la celebration d'un tel evenement dans
>>>l'Illinois serait potentiellement dangereux.
>>			.
>>			.
>>			.
>>Je la doute.  At least one of us misjudges the character
>>of Chicago.  It's part of the assimilationist character
>>of the USA not to know how to hold grudges the way folks
>>do in Ireland, Turkey, South Africa, Peru, Vietnam, ...
>
>Could you be more specific ? What sort of grudges ? Why these countries ?
Oh, I was ill-humoredly provocative, but I'll plunge on,
and be more specific.  Anecdote template:  USAican visits
some old country, engages native in conversation.  Native
says, "Oh, yes, in fact, it was just over that hill there
that the {invaders,protesters,northerners,southerners,...}
killed my uncle."  USAican says, "Really?  That's awful."
Native says, "yes, and it was spring-time."  "What year
was that?"  "[some year before 1800]"  And the US native
thinks he's encountered a strange fellow.

Americans are adolescents (to generalize, in the rather
grossiere manner of s.c.f.).  We're exuberant, ambitious,
..., and have real problems paying attention for longer
than a few hundred seconds (bon, la Guerre entre les Etats
fait une exception que nous pouvons discuter ailleurs).
Je ne puis pas imaginer le danger "potentiel" que vous
attendez en pensant de <<la celebration d'un tel evenement
...>>.  Le May Day--la lutte des classes comprise--n'import
point aux Chicagoans.
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> There are numerous commemorative plaques all over the place in this city, 
>almost for the firt anything: first whiteman wintering, first anglo-whites 
>massacred by indians, first building, first skyscraper etc... 
>If find it disturbing, if not malsain, that May 1st should not also 
>have its own.
Nous sommes d'accord.
			.
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>Why do you want a fireshot again ? Why should it be directed against
>somebody. Mayday demonstrations are not violent anywhere, it is
>a symbol, which is carefully escamoted in Chicago.
			.
			.
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>I don't think it was a "class strugle", since Chicago never really had
>an upper-class. It is a young, modern, and popular city. I don't think
>the issue is in these terms.
			.
			.
			.
Je me suis trompe.  Vous avez ecrit d'une <<... celebra-
tion ... potentiellement dangereux ...>> et je pensais
que il y avait une question sur la probabilite de la
violence.
--

Cameron Laird				+1 713-579-4613
cl@lgc.com (cl%lgc.com@uunet.uu.net)	+1 713-996-8546