Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!wuarchive!uwm.edu!linac!att!bellcore!duncan From: duncan@ctt.bellcore.com (Scott Duncan) Newsgroups: comp.edu Subject: Re: Subtle Math Questions Message-ID: <1991May16.114556.21326@bellcore.bellcore.com> Date: 16 May 91 11:45:56 GMT References: <1991May15.121134.29777@bellcore.bellcore.com> <980.28319d22@vger.nsu.edu> Sender: usenet@bellcore.bellcore.com (Poster of News) Reply-To: duncan@ctt.bellcore.com (Scott Duncan) Organization: Computer Technology Transfer, Bellcore Lines: 53 In article <980.28319d22@vger.nsu.edu> g_harrison@vger.nsu.edu (George C. Harrison, Norfolk State University) writes: > >For those who hire.... I have a question: "Would you HIRE a 4.0 student who >has done nothing but do extremely well in college grades, or would you HIRE >a 2.859 student who was President of the local academic club, raised 2 >children, and has worked 40 hours a week as a manager at Hardies (MacDonalds, >Burger King, Pizza Hut, etc)? Well, I don't hire, but since George posted this in response to things I said, I'll dive in. Realistically, depending on what kind of company one works for (and its size), you may never even see the resume of the person with a 2.859 compared to a 4.0! I have been rejected by the Personnel folks at 3 of my last 4 jobs only to get an interview with an actual technical manager and end up with a job (or an of- fer of one which I turned down for a better offer at a place that had no formal Personnel screening process). I, by the way, was far from college by this time, but in at least one of the cases, I found out that the degree from 1969 was a problem for a job in 1983 despite 11+ years of industry experience! Some places have preestablished "standards" for degree expectations as well as grade point averages and have little or no orientation toward industry (or any other kind) of experience. They prefer people they can mold their own way. On the other hand, if I did get both resumes, none of what George mentions would be sufficient for me to give a job to either person. As I implied in my posting, I'd be interested in seeing how the applicants express themselves and their reasoning ability. I'd also be interested in what sorts of things they value in a job educationally, technically, etc. and why. My assumption (perhaps erroneous) based on what George says is that the 4.0 student probably went straight through to get the degree while the 2.859 stu- dent may have had to take more than 4 years to get the degree given their family and work situation. Thus their life experiences might be very different and that would probably affect how they present themselves and what they have come to value. While I do not make hiring decisions, I have over the years at several jobs done much interviewing and made recommendations to folks who do hire. I have not tended to end up favoring the "4.0 with nothing else to recommend them" kind of people versus the "2.859 who has thought about work and life" sort of person. However, I'm also a person who turned down going for a PhD because I liked to teach undergraduates (who often needed the help) rather than the graduate students (who at least acted a lot like they didn't need anything) and was clearly told that serious faculty didn't do the former. >George C. Harrison, Professor of Computer Science >Norfolk State University, 2401 Corprew Avenue, Norfolk VA 23504Internet: >g_harrison@vger.nsu.edu Phone: 804-683-8654 Speaking only for myself, of course, I am... Scott P. Duncan (duncan@ctt.bellcore.com OR ...!bellcore!ctt!duncan) (Bellcore, 444 Hoes Lane RRC 1H-210, Piscataway, NJ 08854) (908-699-3910 (w) 609-737-2945 (h))