Xref: utzoo trial.talk.politics.peace:119 alt.activism.d:743 talk.politics.misc:70267 soc.men:30802 soc.veterans:199 Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rpi!think.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!cse!utarlg.uta.edu!b645zaw From: b645zaw@utarlg.uta.edu (Stephen Tice) Newsgroups: trial.talk.politics.peace,alt.activism.d,talk.politics.misc,soc.men,soc.veterans Subject: Re: Conscience and Cowardice Message-ID: <1991May29.171445.8340@cse.uta.edu> Date: 29 May 91 15:41:46 GMT References: <9105181851.6056@mydog.UUCP> <1991May28.143655.18701@dg-rtp.dg.com> <1991May29.055718.25895@cs.umn.edu> Sender: usenet@cse.uta.edu (USENET Dummy account for GNUS and TheNews) Reply-To: b645zaw@utarlg.uta.edu Organization: The University of Texas at Arlington Lines: 64 News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4 In article <1991May29.055718.25895@cs.umn.edu>, alberti@donald.cs.umn.edu (Timothy Fay) writes... TF> [...] Would Thoreau, King, or Gandhi TF> have approved of something like that? I doubt it. I like Thoreau's writing since I believe in personal responsibility and family over big goverment and globalism anyday, but Thoreau's disobedience of spending one night in jail for trivial matter's is hardly worthy of standing beside King or Gandhi. Willingness to take a stand, and commitment to a cause are honorable traits, which should be encouraged. King & Gandhi merit honor for just such traits. Men of integrity, commitment and loyalty certainly have it in themselves to "understand" the shortcomings of the immature or confused. They would not overlook disloyalty to their brothers and sisters. TF> If this nation's TF> military was as great as some claim, it would understand that the TF> resisters made a mistake when they signed up, and the military made TF> a mistake by accepting them. It should not compound that mistake by TF> needlessly punishing these people. "This nation's military," is an abstraction. Those good souls, who like our firemen and police, stand vigilant against criminals, fanatics, and power mongers, do so through diligence, discipline, and drill. There is plenty of time to think out your beliefs before the call. When it comes that is the time your fellow ** warriors ** need you to act not debate. The profession of war is something we need to be clear on, so that our young men and women know even before they join what is required of them. Discipline and punishment mean the same. There should be no doubt about what is required when the call is given. TF> The people whose names you invoked were heroes because, among other TF> things, they possessed great understanding and compassion. Perhaps TF> those who want the book thrown at the resisters could learn something TF> from them. We do understand, many hundreds of times during the drills and prepara- tion, you get that chance. It is not compassionate to indulge a coward. It is not compassionate toward the people who rely on him, both those in the breech and those at home. What would you say of a fireman who fails his team? The "resisters", as you call them and show your real agenda, deserve the punishment they'll get. Shall we talk of real cowardness now. The cowardness that makes "life" shallow by fearing death. The cowardness that thinks shortsightedly that mankind will all be benevolent if left to their own devices. What is life without love or truth or freedom? War is a terrible waste, we all agree. Every billion spent on arms would better be spent on that which uplifts us, every drop of blood and sweat better spent on improving our condition. No matter, life is short for each of us, and for all we know for the race as well. It's possible that despite our best efforts that reality may end anytime. I have to live with myself now, and after death the only thing I might carry with me is my experience. I know I was there when my brothers depended on me. Can you say the same? Most Sincerely, Stephen Tice (b645zaw@utarlg.uta.edu) "life's a stage ... W.S." - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Navy: SEAL2(86-87) Apache(85) NWS-satcom(82-84) AAWC-GTMO(80-81) IUWG2(79) Nuke-ET(77-78)