Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!bonnie.concordia.ca!uunet!touch!mikeh
From: mikeh@touch.touch.com (Mike Haas)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.forth
Subject: Re: ANS TC Magnet for Mass Storage
Message-ID: <223@touch.touch.com>
Date: 31 May 91 22:19:38 GMT
References: <9105291721.AA13517@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU>
Organization: Touch Communications
Lines: 36

>
>> Mitch, I don't understand your readiness to discard the heritage with KEY
>> and BLOCK .  My sense of your view toward blocks is, "someone's not-so-
>> bright idea of a way to handle source code."
>
>The issue doesn't revolve around BLOCK, but rather around whether Standard
>source code can contain "invisible" characters.  I don't think it's a good
>idea to allow arbitrary control characters in standard source code.  Standard

Then don't enter them in source code.  But don't limit the functionality of
the system's tools to handle such data.  KEY and BLOCK (ugh) are used for
many thing other than funneling data to the interpreter/compiler.  In fact,
when most forth "applications" are running, doing what they were designed
to do, the often use KEY and BLOCK (no?) and never invoke the interpreter.

Other languages have been adding page formatting control characters
since day 1...right in with their source code.  any forth system worth
it's salt should be able to handle TAB characters as generic whitespace,
like BL.  Why the hell not?  I HATE it when someone designs limitations
into the development tools i have to use...especially forth tools, where
I can type in R> at the keyboard!  This is an advantage, this power.  Why
take it away?  Remember, as a forth developer, you're creating MY tools;
you can't possibly know what I'm going to want to do with them, especially
with a language like forth!

Then there are platforms (like tha amiga) where you can type in ANSI
escape codes to do VT-100-like forms management (including changing
text & background color).  a 7-bit KEY is braindamaged!  Quit trying
to protect me from the power of forth.  Both the mac & amiga use the
full 8 bits for data...don't strip this out just cause your forth
interpreter can't handle it.  forth needs to ADAPT to these systems...
even 8-bit text is old stuff, the world is now trying to figure out
international language support (16 bits & MORE!)...THIS IS WHAT WE
SHOULD BE FIGURING OUT!...
not whether KEY is gonna pass 8 bits!  ludicrous.  ADAPT...
it may be in Websters, but it sure isn't in many 'forth' dictionaries!