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From: snitor!petert@uunet.UU.NET (Peter Toth)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Walther PPK/S 380 ACP
Message-ID: <35248@mimsy.umd.edu>
Date: 5 Jun 91 14:27:49 GMT
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In article <35138@mimsy.umd.edu> boyd@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (Mickey Boyd) writes:
#In article <35127@mimsy.umd.edu>, snitor!petert@uunet.UU.NET (Peter Toth) writes:
##Actually there is a 3in barreled  straight blowback .45 on the US market :^).
##You see, straight blowback actions are smaller than recoil ones.
##That's smaller, friend, not more shootable. Smaller.
#[...]
#I believe John Browning invented this type of action.  One advantage with this
#type of action is that you can have a lighter (and thus SMALLER) slide on the 
#gun.  

Lighter slide maybe, smaller, not necessarily. The recoil operated action,
slide and all, is taller than the simple blowback.  It also has more parts
than the simple blowback.

#At this time I will pull a quote:  "In order for a pistol of reasonable
#weight and dimensions to handle cartridges more potent than the .380 ACP, it 
#becomes necessary to keep the breech mechanism locked up for a brief interval
#after firing.  The usual term for that approach is delayed blowback."  (Dean 
#A. Grennell, _Autoloading Pistols_, pg. 37).  

The problems are:
- preventing the action from significantly opening before
  the pressure drops below such levels that will shred the unsupported case,
- preventing the case mouth clearing the chamber while the pressure is
  high enough to produce unacceptable levels of exhaust though the breech.

Indeed, one of the many solutions is John Moses Browning's barrel-to-slide
lockup. Another is a heavy slide/bolt, a common smg solution.
Another is some cammed and sprung delay mechanism, such as in the HK or Luger. 
Or:
#NOTE:  You could also solve this problem with a REALLY strong slide-return 
#spring, but then you would need some sort of big lever to chamber the first
#round.  You would not be able to cycle the action by hand. 

I have no idea how they circumvent the strong spring problem.

So we agree that this IS the way to make the smallest, lightest pistol?

Such guns ARE a bastard to shoot, but some people are willing to learn to
deal with them so they can haul a small potent package.
Obviously this approach is aimed at the not so squeamish.

Of course, if you are not a beggar for pain, or have an interest in sufficient
controllability for longer ranges, that's another matter entirely.

#So what is the name of the .45ACP?

Nova 45ACP. It's 38 ounces loaded (6+1), and measures 7.1x4.6x1.3in.
LaFrance Specialities
POBox 17822
Dept HGI
San Diego, Ca 92117

They also have a smaller 45 (5+1), for cops only, as well as a tiny 9mm,
even smaller than the Detonics (24oz loaded).

Peter Toth