Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uwm.edu!csd4.csd.uwm.edu!info-high-audio-request From: bill@verdix.com (William Spencer) Newsgroups: rec.audio.high-end Subject: Re: Subwoffer Driver Rec's Wanted (* + addresses*) Message-ID: <13208@uwm.edu> Date: 18 Jun 91 12:59:53 GMT Sender: news@uwm.edu Lines: 178 Approved: tjk@csd4.csd.uwm.edu Originator: tjk@csd4.csd.uwm.edu in article <13024@uwm.edu>, shimizu@unix.sri.com (Dan Shimizu) says: > I just heard about the Audio Concept > 12" (AC12 Mk.2). They sound good, does anyone have any experience > with these drivers? I got some AC10's recently. Sound pretty good I guess -- I still haven't incorporated them into my main design yet though. I have a couple of complaints though. They nicely don't glue on the front gasket so front mounting looks better. But the foam surround actually sticks out in front of the frame which can cause trouble. Even worse, the foam is caught between mounting screws and the frame. Tightening the screw can cause the foam to be pulled loose. I'm not sure how other speakers deal with this. Maybe the gasket just keeps you from seeing the damage, I don't know, but I've never seen this problem before. I used a 2.77 cu. ft. box, stuffed. By attempting to avoid booming with a low Q alignment I actually got more boom. The tuning is a low 32 Hz or so but that is all but inaudible due to rolloff. Meanwhile, room and floor effects cause booming in the 70-80 Hz region and suckout in the range above that. Raising it makes the bass even leaner but lowering it helps. However, only in subwoofer use can the low position work well in my experience. Too much distance between the woofer and midrange results. Porting seemed promising. Brought out that deep bass even in a marginal tuning. >From my understanding it looks like this woofer is best suited to a tuning with some peaking in the deep bass. If the room effect causes more peaking at a higher frequency though the over all effect may be better in a subwoofer application. I have heard that these woofers are made by Carbonneau. The have their own line which is both cheaper and possibly better including rubber surround types, carbon impregnated poly cones, and heavy paper cones. I don't know about multiple specs from Audio Concepts, but they have different response graphs. Of course they may all be right for different samples and test methods. Carbonneau now includes computer generated plots and real response curves in their documentation. The real curves all look poorer than the simulated ones. The Madisound woofers have fairly flimsy cones according to reports and my own experience. They can still work well I guess. The Precision/Swan woofers are not intended for sealed boxes but are better made from what I hear. Don't know about the Eclipse (Meniscus?) woofers. Pyles are sort of a compromise between the hi-fi types and sound reinforcement types and are good in some applications. The point about building an experimental box is a good one. You might be better buying boxes also -- life is too short to spend building very plain rectangular boxes. You can enclose drivers seperate for more flexibility when experimenting. When you're ready for 2" thick pyramids or whatever then you'll have to go custom. Bill Spencer P.S. A couple of addresses: Parts Express 340 E First St. Dayton Ohio 45402 800 338 0531 Eminence (Cast, Regular, "Thruster"), Pioneer, Sanyo (CHEAP!), MG ("Professional" components, not credited to MG in catalog), a few Phillips and Polydax components, Motorola (piezos) Best prices within selection. Not "high-end" oriented. Also VCR parts and other electronics, low cost boxes (including stage monitors). MCM Electronics 650 Congress Park Dr. Centerville Ohio 45459-4072 513 434 0031 Pyle, Electro-Voice (standard 12,15, and 18" only, at best prices), Pioneer, MG, Pyramid. Also repair parts, meters, oscilloscopes. Reasonably priced quality enclosures. Caution, I have found some errors in specs given (1W/1M != 1W/1ft.) Gold Sound P.O. Box 141 Englewood, CO 80151 303 789 5310 Catalog $2 JBL, E-V, Gold Sound (serious), Audax, Morel, SEAS. Good prices. Serious about "pro" components. Catalog includes tiny response graphs for most drivers. McGee Radio 1901 McGee St. Kansas City, Missouri 64108-1891 816 842 5092 Orders 800 87MCGEE Catalog $2 More expensive but some good bits. Polydax, Pyle (full line), Motorola (would you believe a deal on a Piezo driver and an E-V horn combo?), E-V (near full line), MTX. Madisound Speaker Components 8608 University Green Box 4283 Madison, Wisconsin 53711 608 831 3433 Peerless, Madisound (low cost, fairly flimsy but OK), Eclipse, Morel, KEF, Vifa, Focal, Dynaudio, Eton, many crossover components. A few good kits. *Catalog includes graphs, etc. for many drivers.* Woodstyle enclosures. Audio Concepts 901 S. 4th St. La Crosse, WI 54601 800 346 9183 tech questions 608 784 4570 Kits, Dynaudio, Focal, SEAS (very limited selection of most popular pieces on these 3), Audio Concepts (I called them, the JC12 subwoofer _really_ has an Xmax of 11 cm.!). Crossover components, speaker designs, info, Loudspeaker Design Cookbooks. A & S Speakers 3170 23rd St. San Fransisco CA 94110 415 641 4573 Scan-Speak, VMPS (complete speakers AND drivers), Eton, Dynaudio, Audax/Polydax, Eminence (short list), Focal, Morel, Peerless, MB-electronics (titanium dome tweeters), Phillips, SEAS, Nelson-Reed, Crossover parts & assemblies, Woodstyle cabinets. Speaker designs. SRS Enterprises "The Speaker Shop" 318 S. Wahsatch Ave. Colorado Springs, Co. 80903 719 475 2545 Pyle, Pioneer. Prices good. Full Pyle line. Carbonneau 609 Myrtle N.W. Grand Rapids Michigan 49504 616 456 9528 3 lines of woofers: 20% graphite reinforced polypropylene cone with foam suspension, same with rubber suspension (lower frequency & efficiency), and treated paper cone with rubber. Includes dual voice coil subwoofers. Range 5.25" to 12". Good prices. Caution: my catalog has "preliminary" specs. Zalytron Industries 469 Jericho Turnpike Mineola, NY 11501 516 747 3515 Polydax, Siare, Vieta, SEAS, Dynaudio, Focal, Cabasse, Phillips, Zalytron, crossover compenents, etc. Transducer Technology (Division of Watters Sound Wave Co.) 4320 Spring Valley Rd. Dallas, TX 75244 214 991 6994 Cabasse (full line of concave diaphram/dome drivers), Accuton (Thiel GmbH, not the other Thiel; very neutral concave _ceramic_ dome mids and tweeters) Vieta, Audiom by Focal (professional Focal line, pricey), Stage Accompany (professional ribbon/leaf drivers, woofers, systems, pricey), Tekton (sub-bass)