Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rpi!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!samsung!uunet!world!eff!ckd From: ckd@eff.org (Christopher Davis) Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk Subject: Re: Repost from Telecom Message-ID: Date: 23 Jun 91 23:13:43 GMT References: <91174.131736ELE@psuvm.psu.edu> Sender: ckd@eff.org (Christopher Davis) Organization: The Electronic Frontier Foundation Lines: 70 In-Reply-To: ELE@psuvm.psu.edu's message of 23 Jun 91 17:17:36 GMT Bill> == bill@ssbn.wlk.com (Bill Kennedy) (Warning: sarcasm ahead, and "when you bring the Nazis into a USENET discussion, it's long dead." Even so...) Bill> Tanner makes my point with precision. Let me enumerate the damage Bill> done which could have been avoided had Len acted more responsibly: Churchill makes my point with precision. Let me enumerate the damage done which could have been avoided had the French acted more responsibly: Bill> Steve Jackson games - They never would have become vulnerable to SS Bill> abuse had Len not made excursions beyond reason and the law. This Bill> wasn't Tanner's point, but it's my take on it. Belgium - they never would have become vulnerable to Wehrmacht abuse had the French not made excursions beyond reason and the law. Bill> Usenet killer/attctc - This invaluable resource and national spoke in Bill> the Usenet wheel would not have been shut down had Len not decided to Bill> joyride beyond the bounds of propriety and common sense. Berlin - this invaluable city and international spoke in the European wheel would not have been divided for 40 years had the French not decided to joyride beyond the bounds of propriety and common sense. Bill> Southwestern Bell - I'd use his name but I don't have his permission. Bill> He lost his job, for all intent and purposes, despite his *total* Bill> exhonoration in the matter. He was put under a microscope, Bill> intimidated, and otherwise mistreated and had to leave the company. Bill> His only "mistake"? He was honestly and innocently associated with Bill> Len Rose. Random Warsaw Jew - I'd use his name but I don't have his permission. He lost his life, for all intent and purposes, despite his *total* innocence in the matter. He was put into a ghetto, intimidated, and otherwise mistreated and had to leave this Earth. His only "mistake"? He was honestly and innocently associated with his religion. [etc] Bill> Here's my point. I don't care what anyone says or thinks about right Bill> or wrong with regard to Len Rose. My animosity and resentment stems Bill> from the "collateral damage" caused by a long standing collection of Bill> really bone headed things that the man did. Do you excuse the rabid dog that bites a group of children because "someone provoked it"? Len Rose is human. He has made mistakes. I don't think he can honestly be blamed for EVERYTHING that happened, though. Yes, some of his mistakes were the proximate causes of things that happened, but the underlying mistrust, misunderstanding, and mishandling that are the *root* causes cannot be laid at his feet. Bill> Don't slather me with "it was the big bad feds"; had he not Bill> attracted their attention they'd have left him (and the rest of Bill> us) alone. 'Nuff said, I thought you ought to know. Don't slather me with "it was the big bad Nazis"; had he not attracted their attention they would have only taken Czechoslovakia and left the rest of us alone. This kind of apologia and appeasement doctrine angers me. Again, Len made mistakes, and, yes, some of them hurt innocent people. The blame does not lie solely with him, and we must attack the root causes of the problem. "Guilt by association" should not reign supreme again. -- Christopher Davis | ELECTRONIC MAIL WORDS OF WISDOM #5: System Manager & Postmaster | "Internet mail headers are Electronic Frontier Foundation | not unlike giblets." +1 617 864 0665 | -- Paul Vixie