Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rpi!usc!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!caen!umich!vela!sycom!rkushner From: rkushner@sycom.UUCP (Ronald Kushner) Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy Subject: Re: Commodore Business Machines Message-ID: Date: 26 Jun 91 02:11:16 GMT References: <7471@vela.acs.oakland.edu> <7514@vela.acs.oakland.edu> Organization: Michigan Information eXchange Lines: 165 lmbailey@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Laurana Bailey) writes: >In article rkushner@sycom.UUCP (Ronald Kushner) wri >| lmbailey@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Laurana Bailey) writes: >| >To me, this says that something just isn't right down at the blue and >| >red. Al cited the fact that at the dealer's conference that was held >| >when Copperman first arrived more advertising, a virtual blitz they >| >were told, was about to be launched. TV, Print, Radio. The works. >| >Everyone was excited and went home to wait and watch. Alas, there were ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Geeze, what a good attitude to have....No wonder you guys are all screwed up, its corperate socialism I smell now that I read your message better...This is the same thing as looking to the government for EVERYTHING!!! Except instead of the government, you guys are looking to Commodore for all the handouts!!! >| >many market areas virtually untouched by this "Blitz". Al's area, and >| >even here in the Metro Detroit area, saw little, if any, of the ads >| >and then they were usually on around 1 or 2 A.M. when most of the >| >world was asleep. >| >| HA! Bullshit! If I had every dollar that Commodore spent advertising in >| Detroit on WXYZ, WKBD, and Preview Guide in 1989, I would guarantee you that >| I probably would have quarter of a million dollars by now....They ran ads >| every day for TWO months on Detroit's top rated, top dollar news(5PM-7PM >| Action News, WXYZ). They ran ads on FOX television(WKBD TV50, Detroit) durin >| the Simpsons, they ran ads in the Detroit Free Press in the business section >| (third page, with ALL dealers listed that mattered), and they also advertise >| on Preview Guide quite a bit....At least 3 times a day... > >I watch television quite a bit and I rarely ever saw anything near >prime-time in terms of advertising from Commodore. The Preview Guide? >Big deal. Who sits around and watches the preview guide? Combine that >with the fact that I don't have cable and that not everyone else does >either and you see a large chunk of wasted advertising. I never once >saw a single Commodore ad during the Simpsons and I am an avid >Simpsons follower. I saw ONE ad in the Free Press. One. It was a good >one, but it was one. I have ALL KINDS OF VIDEO TAPES around here, people come over here and call me a video king, I have tapes going WAY BACK TO 1984...I can pull out tapes and let it run from FOX and the Simpsons, and let you see the Commodore ads...You're memory isn't all that good...I have the ads here on tape to prove they did advertise.. >And where is all that wonderful advertising now? WHEN was the last >time you saw even the horrorible Stevie commercials? The dealers were >told that this would be a CONTINUING advertising campaign. So where is >it? It isn't there. Where's your local dealers ads? I see MSD(?) advertise in the Free Press computer corner...Ever see it? Mostly they run small 2 line WE FIX AMIGAS ads...But when powerup came out they ran a 3 or 4 line classified... >| >| Don't twist things because someone else (Les and Al) is. I'll bet Archie at >| MicroWorld would tear Commodore down and burn them as well, because he never >| paid for parts for the longest time and Commodore doesn't keep dealers that >| don't pay the bills.... > >I share the same viewpoints as Les and I have talked with Al. Al has >kept up with his payments for the things he's ordered. Al's stores are >not MicroWorlds and while I agree that MicroWorld is guilty of bad >business, Al's store isn't. > >It is also very hard to pay one's bills when the machine one is trying >to sell just is NOT selling. Go into Slipped Disk and ask how sales >are. Generally they will tell you they're not that great. At least >thats what they've been telling me. Get iBM's in there if he has to pay the bills...Look at Microworld!! They are the worlds worst computer store, and they are STILL operating...How many people did they screw through their MCS mail order scamhouse??? You need a bread and butter business....And even if you do get IBM's in there, you will HAVE TO ADVERTISE on your own like PC-Supply does...I have never been to PC-Supply but am very aware that they exist.. >| You have to be OBJECTIVE when you want to consider if the Amiga is good or >| not. You can not have birdies telling you things and give them MORE credibli >| than the facts...If you don't like the Amiga and really believe its going do >| the tubs, TAKE DOWN THE BBS, SELL THE EQUIPMENT, and get it behind you befor >| its worthless...Get yourself a 586sx with your $100 VGA board and be >| happy..But someone that gripes all the time is never happy..I know, I WAS IN >| THE SERVICE BUSINESS for awhile.... > >First, I pointed out that I LIKE the machine and am happy with THE >MACHINE. Re-read my post and it should be clear to you. I never >complained about what the MACHINE had or didn't have. As long as there >are things available for it I will continue to use it. What I am NOT >happy with is CBM. They are a disaster at marketing and managing the >Amiga and EVERYONE knows it. You may recall an article in FORBES >magazine that stated the same thing. You are not happy, and when you are not happy with something, you sell it. Like my A2000 W/GVP HD controller....I sold the S.O.B. because after I started getting into HD controllers it was a mess...I still don't think there is one A2000 controller out there that I would be happy with...Advocacy isn't a place to tear down the Amiga constantly(MB style)...The NeXT people do a good enough job at it without any help..Do you want cutting edge stuff when the whole Amiga philosophy is based on mass production of custom chips used across the line to bring down the cost of the low priced machines...Why do you think they came out with CDTV? The more they make, the cheaper the A500's become.. >I watch several shows on satelite tv dealing with stocks. Everytime I >hear Commodore mentioned I also hear things like: "Nice product, but >the company is floundering in getting it marketed to the masses. No >stability." Most often I have heard folks advising AGAINST purchass of >CBM stock. NOT because it doesn't have a good product, but because >they don't know what the hell to do with it. Good, thats THEIR views...Alot of people make alot of money on Commodore stock, just because it goes way up and way down every 12 months....Its allmost like old faithful...You are just another lemming listening to everyone else instead of going to the Library and looking up what their stock has done...Who made you Charles Swab anyways?? >Second, I never claimed any of this to be OBJECTIVE. I'm not a news >reporter, I am a consumer and like all consumers I shop by how I feel >about things, not by trying to be objective about it. If computer >buyers were objective people they would all realize what a MESS MS-DOS >is and wouldn't BUY IBMs. Judging from the number of IBMers in the >world I would have to say that there are a lot of SUBJECTIVE people >out there. HA! Thats where you go wrong, by saying, I HAVE TO BE BIASED..I am a dumbflub liberal, a brainless conserative, lameass communist, etc.... You have to look at EVERYTHING objectively..You have to do research ON YOUR OWN, not let people tell you how it is...You have to go from personal feelings, your own data, not what others THINK!! Otherwise you're just a lemming..and lemmings normally buy IBMs..So you're saying since I am a consumer, and since the average consumer is dumb, I should be dumb as well!?? I might scream about GVP, but if they come out with a product that I want, and I look at every product thats simular, and pick the best, and its GVP, I will buy it, because I always look at everything objectivly...But they are harassing me, so what do you want? Does Commodore call you up and haggle you?? >Your solution to the problem seems simple enough: "If you don't like >the company then sell your machine and get an IBM and put it all >behind you" Gee, that sounds an awful lot like what some people tell Damn right...It only took me .5 seconds to think up that solution as well!! If you don't like the food don't eat it... >others who are complaining about the US Government. "If you don't like >it, go back to your own damn country." Seems to me a lot of people >with your attitude are running CBM and thats probably why they're >doing such a cruddy job at it. Ha! If the people running CBM had my attitudes they would be kicking ass, and you wouldn't be complaining (in 5 years, it takes time to correct things) about 256 colors and dealer support...BECAUSE YOUR GUY AL WOULD BE OUT OF BUSINESS...I WOULD REALLY BE PUSHING HARD TO GET COMPUSA TO CARRY AMIGAS(High end machines)...And the low end jobbies would be in K-Mart with K-Mart advertising the sucker, not me! K-Mart now has realized they have to advertise products and not depend on the manafacture to...Notice their latest ads?! -- C-UseNet V0.42e Ronald Kushner Life in Hell BBS +1 (313) 939-6666 P.O. Box 353 14400 USR HST V.42 & V.42bis Sterling Heights, MI 48311-0353 Complete Amiga Support UUCP: uunet!umich!vela!sycom!rkushner (We are not satanic, just NUTS!) If I had a nickel for every time Elizabeth Taylor was married I would have $.35