Newsgroups: soc.religion.eastern Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rpi!think.com!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!stanford.edu!eos!data.nas.nasa.gov!news From: skumar@smdvx1.intel.com (Sitanshu Kumar) Subject: Re: Seven Stages of Life - Da Avabhasa References: <1991Jun25.164146.11472@nas.nasa.gov> Date: Wed, 26 Jun 91 00:17:25 GMT Approved: prabhu@amelia.nas.nasa.gov Organization: Microprocessor Component Group, Intel Corp., Santa Clara, CA Sender: news@nas.nasa.gov Message-ID: <1991Jun26.001725.20873@nas.nasa.gov> Lines: 90 In article <1991Jun25.164146.11472@nas.nasa.gov> radams@cerritos.edu writes: >skumar@smdvx1.intel.com (s. Kumar) writes: > >>Are you saying that I misunderstood Mr. John?? is that the case?, I am >>just saying that he is plainly deluded, just a glib talker. If you >>want to discuss this post anything by Mr. John and I'll analyse it. >>This s no great deed. Mr. John lacks humility completely, so is >>the case with bookish scholars. All the wise ones have said I can not >>give it to you, and this guy is blowing his trumpet that he is the >>greatest and also can make any body like him , what a charlatan?? >>insight is insight, it does not belong to anybody. If it does it is >>not insight. > >I agree totally with the above. Now, how can we tell the difference >between a true guru and a dime-store guru? Let me try to respond to this >question. A true guru does not blow his/her own horn and claim to be >able to enlighten you. A guru can help, but we are already the Self so >nobody can make you as such since you are already the Self.. What the >guru _can_ do is help you get rid of the notion that you are somehow >separate or separated from God (Self) and need to find God somewhere out >in heaven. The Guru does not need to blow his/her own horn or brag >since he/she is a projection of your very own Self and is instantly >known by you as being such when you are ready for this kind of help. >A true guru does not advertise on the back of breakfast cereal boxes >(although I'm not suggesting that Da has done so - but then I don't >eat cereals that often ;-) nor does a true guru say he is a great holy >BEING or Messenger or a living proof of something or other. An illumined >master has no one to brag to since duality is non-existent in him/her. I did not want to go into the question of self, but it keeps comming up on the net, so here is the following. >From very ancient times, it has been said in India( from the times of Lord Rama or before, approx 6000-7000 years) that when the human mind is free of four evils ( greed, lust, anger , attachement) then there is a state of complete bliss.(sat+chit+ananada). Beyond that state of complete bliss there is another, which is "HOLY' called the self. before the state of bliss, there is a state called "shunaya" from which the universe is derived and in which it exists( this includes the whole of cosmos, any thing that is perceived by the senses or can be thought). But to talk of these states while the mind is still caught in the four evils is meaningless exercise, at best intellectual entertainment with its deeply deluding effects. The effect of the four evils is that they keep the mind in perpetual motion so that none of the states ( shunya, blissfullness or self ) can take root. Only when the mind is perfectly still that any one can take root. These are not states to be talked about lightly, only one in a billion is likely to go anywhere close.( this not my conclusion, it is from the Gita if you want to know) For example a person in the state of shunya can see the creation of the entire cosmos,(including the innumerable exploding stars) and so on. Even before one reaches Shunya one has to see one own innumerable lifes and so on. You see it is all very-very complicated and utterly beyond description. On the net I see people claiming that my guru is enlightened, that is very-very juvenile. Those who are relly enlightened say so only once or twice in thier "lifetime" ( I can give examples if you want). Ya there are some people who have some understanding, but to cliam they are enlightened is ??? You know there are text that do describe how a "purusha" talks, walks, sleeps, etc. etc. ( this is quite common knowledge in India) . But all this is not so important. What is important is how the mind is freed from from the four evils. S. Kumar A A A A A stars and so on) and so on....... D Lord Rama, or before 6000-7000 years) > > > > > Roger Adams > > radams@cerritos.edu To those in whom love dwells, > Cerritos College the whole world is one family. > 11110 Alondra Blvd A Hindu Proverb > Norwalk, California 90650 > USA >-------------------------------------------------------------------------------