From: utzoo!decvax!ucbvax!sf-lovers Newsgroups: fa.sf-lovers Title: SF-LOVERS Digest V6 #96 Article-I.D.: ucbvax.200 Posted: Fri Dec 3 22:29:12 1982 Received: Sun Dec 5 07:58:40 1982 >From SFL@SRI-CSL Fri Dec 3 22:05:09 1982 Reply-To: SF-LOVERS at SRI-CSL To: SF-LOVERS@SRI-CSL SF-LOVERS Digest Saturday, 4 Dec 1982 Volume 6 : Issue 96 Today's Topics: SF convention calendar Books - Bradley's Darkover, Chalker's Well-World, Space Cat Themes - shrinking, time travel Misc - Bookstores Query - Sharra? Radio - Dr. Demento Movies - make one in space, Star Wars / TESB clonage and the Other, Revenge of the Jedi, Star Trek T.V. - Star Trek and Kirk's Omega Glory recitation ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 3 December 1982 03:55 est From: Schauble.Multics at MIT-MULTICS Subject: SF convention calendar Do you know the current location of Zellich's sf convention calendar? If not, please put a query in the digest. Paul ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 0031-PST From: Zellich at OFFICE-3 (Rich Zellich) Subject: SF Cons listing updated OFFICE-3 file CONS.TXT has been updated and is now ready for FTP. OFFICE-3 supports the net-standard "ANONYMOUS" Login within FTP, using any password. CONS.TXT is currently 941 lines (or 44,017 characters). Please try to limit your FTP jobs to before 0600-CDT and after 1600-CDT if possible, as the system is heavily loaded during the day. Enjoy, Rich ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 1023-EST From: Stephen R Balzac Subject: Darkover Chronologically, the first book is Darkover Landfall. I think the next one is Storm Queen, but am not sure. I can probably find out within a few days. (or send me a list of the titles and I can put them in order for you. I just don't remember what they all are, off hand.) ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 12:44:53-EST From: csin!cjh at CCA-UNIX Subject: re darkover MZB has said repeatedly that all of the books are independent and can be read individually (with the possible exception of two pairs). If you're really interested in tracing Darkovan history you're better off getting the concordance rather than trying to disentangle the books. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 1115-EST From: Joseph M. Newcomer Subject: He Who Shrank By H. Hesse, appeared in Amazing in 1936. It has been reprinted in Healy & McComas, Adventures in Time and Space (Ballantine 1975) Asimov, Before the Golden Age (if you have the paperback series, it is in volume 3) joe ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 12:45:38-EST From: csin!cjh at CCA-UNIX Subject: shrinking people Just remembered one that it seems nobody else has heard of: MANALONE by Colin Kapp (English author, I believe he died recently). The MITSFS has a British edition; I doubt it was ever published in this country. Not much good as the entire plot keys on this one character realizing that as a solution to the population problem people have been shrunk to ca. 2 feet tall but think everything is normal (the [hero] starts finding artifacts and mistaking them because of scale problems, e.g. a creamer is believed to be a teapot). Kapp has done some good books, including THE WIZARD OF ANHARITTE (a classic ASTOUNDING SF story that somehow came out in IF in 1972) and THE SURVIVAL GAME (similar theme). Rated ALP: THE CHAOS WEAPON, a "sequel" to PATTERNS OF CHAOS (ok). ------------------------------ Date: 3 December 1982 01:04-EST From: "James Lewis Bean, Jr." Subject: Sharra? I have seen several references to a character named Sharra. Who is Sharra? lewis bean at mit-mc ------------------------------ Date: 2 Dec 82 19:48:25 EST (Thu) From: Tim Maroney Subject: Re: Who the Well is Nathan Brazil? Nathan Brazil lied about being God, or so he later claimed. It is rather difficult to understand what "God" would be in the Markovian universe, anyway; the person who made the Markovians? As to why Brazil turned Markovian inside the Well of Souls: I believe that the console could only be accessed by a Markovian, so the computer automatically made Brazil capable, assuming tha that was what he came for. What I like most about the Well World books is the incredible stream of creativity, and the relatively coherent way in which these extremely diverse and unusual elements are combined. I'm more than willing to admit a few deficiencies in Chalker's style, though; I just think his imagination makes up for these small flaws. Tim Maroney tim.unc@udel-relay (I'm sure!) ------------------------------ From: duntemann.wbst Date: 3-Dec-82 12:56:42 EST Subject: Space Cat! If I can credit anything with making me go after a career (as yet only partially realized) of writing SF, it would have to be Space Cat. As Gail mentioned a few issues back, it was a series of children's books written by Ruthven (pronounced "Rivven") Todd. I know of only four in the series, and they are good beyond price, assuming you haven't completely lost the feel for how you felt at age 7. Briefly: SPACE CAT: Air force colonel picks up a stray cat on the way to a secret project called ZQX-1. ZQX-1 is a rocketship a la destination Moon, and said colonel is assigned to pilot it. Colonel cons the air force into building a space suit for Flyball and fitting a spring-loaded g-hammock into the ship for him. Flyball and colonel reach the Moon in ZQX-1. Colonel falls down in a cave an d springs a leak. Flyball patches leak in colonel's helmet with a sticky sand-dollar shaped life-form growing in the cave. Flyball runs into some baloon creatures which have the interesting ability to float in mid-vacuum. (Even I caught that booboo, at age 7) ZQX-1 returns home safe. one gets the impression Flyball is the brains of the outfit. SPACE CAT VISITS VENUS: Flyball and Colonel take a refitted ZQX-1 to Venus, where they encounter telepathic moss, ammonia storms, and (best of all) a creature called a wyrgmbumia which resembles a bunch of bananas with sagebrush growing on top, very evil and a dastardly streetfighter. Colonel gets half-swallowed by the wyrgmbumnia before Flyball dispatches it. SPACE CAT MEETS MARS: On the way back from Venus colonel finds the ZQX-1 has blue venus sand fused into the rocket tubes. Since Earth is on the other side of the sun, they take a long orbit to Mars to clean the tubes out. While on Mars they find six-legged talking mice (interesting problem for Flyball) and a native lady Martian cat named Moofa. Once the colonel cleans out the tubs and has some other adventures, the three of them return to Earth. SPACE CAT AND THE KITTENS: Some time later, Earth has built a hyperdriven spaceship namedd Einstein, and Flyball and Moofa have produced a pair of kittens, Marty and Tailspin. Together they go off to Alpha Centauri with the colonel and another man. They find a planet full of miniature dinosaurs. Flyball and Moofa take a back seat to the kittens this time. After a great fight with an 18-inch tyrannosaurus, they all bundle up and head back. Dumb, huh? I suppose. There were some really well-done drawings in the books, and Flyball in particular had an ironic grin that I will always remember. I'll gladly pay five bucks for any of these books in any condition, and ten bucks for any in really good condition. Were it not for Flyball, I could well have grown up to be an insurance salesman. THAT is a debt not easily repaid. --Jeff Dunteman 301 Susquehanna Road Rochester NY 14618 (duntemann.wbst@PARC-MAXC) ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 2118-EST From: DAA at MIT-DMS (David A. Adler) Subject: Bookstore Re: gail at RAND-UNIX's book list The unknown bookstore in Cambridge is the Science Fantasy Bookstore at 18 Eliot Street. It is located in Harvard Square across from the Harvard/Brattle MBTA bus stop. According to their add in the phone book they are New England's largest selection of SF&F books. They have a wide selection of both used and new books. --David ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 82 21:24:42 EST (Fri) From: Rene Steiner Subject: Time travel There are a lot of books concerning time travel, some good and some not so good. What are some favorites? Some of my favorite odd ones are: Dinosaur Beach (Keith Laumer?) The Man who Folded Himself (David Gerrold -my main objection is the fact that it's TOTALLY subjective - there is no mention of the outside world. On the other hand, it would be hard to write that story any other way.) The Flight of the Horse (Larry Niven) Roadmarks (Zelazny, and which may not count...) Tne I didn't particularly care for was called (I think) "Mammoth" and was about a house built in the age of the dinosaurs. I'm not really sure why I didn't like it (I read it a few years ago); something to do with Not Much Happens. Anyone care to branch into this subject of discussion? - rene ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 1147-PST From: KRIEGER Subject: some miscellaneous commenta Comments. Anyway, I have been taking in various discussions going on in SFLD, and now that I feel that the dust has settled, I shall voice a few thoughts. re: Star Trek. The Doomsday Machine and Balance of Terror are indeed two great episodes. William Windom's performance as Matt Decker in the latter is a great standout for fanatics of unbalanced people. This is an old note, but there was a character named Decker in ST-TMP. In The City on the Edge of Forever, the potion McCoy injected himself with was an overdose of Cordrazine, which he brought to the bridge to administer a VERY SMALL dose to Sulu, who had been hurt while the Enterprise was being jostled by the "storm," which was actually "waves of time displacement." The woman Kirk falls in love with was named Edith Keeler. In defense of The Savage Curtain (anybody know why it was called that? My ignorance is showing), I thought the molten-lava creature, Yarnek of Excalbia, was a GREAT alien. Also, we got a chance to converse with Surak, "father of all we (the Vulcans) hold true." About Spock's brain, the person (sorry) who was talknig about confusion between 6th and 7th planets wrote about Sigma Draconis XII (12): watch when you change numerals. Last note on ST: Yes, I have read that Assignment: Earth was a pilot. re: Shrinking. An obscure, C-grade (or worse) movie with a dumb title was made called "Attack of the Puppet people." It starred John Hoyt as a slightly deranged scientist who liked to shrink people because he was lonely (I think). Supposedly loosely based on "Dr. Cyclops." As for "The Incredible Shrinking Man" shrinking down to nothing, recall that the last line of the movie is "To God, there is no zero; I STILL EXIST." re: Exp. Dec. This is the least technical or even apllicable to the replies on this subject, but in "Moonraker," Drax gets whooshed out into space at the end. I won't prolong a discussion on this poor excuse for a James Bond film (even a film). re: Star Wars. I, too, lean toward the idea that the "another" in "No, there is another." is an as yet unknown character; my impressions come from stuff I have heard and read. Some of you people are really creative out there, though. I also am leaning toward clone theories, i.e., the following pairs: Obi-wan/Emperor, and Vader/Luke's Father. I love how Lucas (or whoever else is responsible) is so vague in things like this, and also such things as "the son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi." Thanks heaps for the information. We have minds, so we may speculate. I haven't read for pleasure in months. I'm sincerely thinking about picking up THE MOON IS A HARSH MISTRESS because it has so many recommendations from people regarding its AI themes. Until I should ever decide to speak again, John ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 0128-EST From: Steven J. Zeve Subject: Dr. Demento in New Jersey As of the last I know, Dr. Demento can be heard on WAPP (a new NYC station) in the northern areas of New Jersey. I don't know the station frequency exactly, but it's an FM station somewhere around 103.5. 'Fraid I don't know where Dr. Demento can be found in western Massachussetts though. Steve Z. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Dec 82 23:43:08-EST (Thu) From: Steve Platt Subject: Assorted movies, tv, trash Referring to "the other" is clearly a typographical error; Yoda has quite obviously stating, "...there is the author's hope..." Dig it; Lucas walking on-stage over to Vader, "Ok big guy, no more special effects for you..." I think my favorite ST episode is the last one. You may interpret that how you will. -s ------------------------------ Date: 1 Dec 82 2:19:48-PST (Wed) From: decvax!utzoo!watmath!bstempleton at Ucb-C70 Subject: Movies in space, and idea for George Lucas A recent mention of movies in space brought back to me an old idea that I have had for some time. It might be neat if this message got to Lucasfilms, although I won't be surprised if they have not already thought of this. The idea is to make a movie in the space shuttle, a science-fiction one. Such a movie would be about the near future exploration of space. The special effects would be great and you could get real weightless shots. The nice thing is that this is quite possible. A director like George Lucas or Steven Spielberg could afford to rent one shuttle flight, although it would make the movie perhaps the most expensive ever made. They could recover the cost because: a) The film would become an instant classic, as the first movie made in space. People would see it even if it were crap. b) A name like Lucas making an SF movie would cause millions to see it even if it weren't in the shuttle. The interesting point is that you could probably simulate the weightless conditions with special effects right on earth for less then the rental of a shuttle. The reasons to take the shuttle are a) You can advertise that you shot the film in space and b) The director gets to go up on the shot, probably to act as cameraman as well, and thus realizes the dream of many an SF person, which is to go into space. Find actors that can stand the free-fall and I'd be glad to crew such a mission. NASA might also approve because of their plan of taking artists into space to bring back the message of space to the people. What better way to do it than a Lucasfilms movie? ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 09:02 EST Subject: Send in the Clones From: Chris Heiny In the book versions of both SW & TESB the wars in which Obiwan, Darth, papa Skywalker, etc. are involved are referred to as the >Clone< wars, not the >Colon< wars. Princess Leia's last name is Organa, which would probably account for all the Organia confusion. chris ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 1034-EST From: Stephen R Balzac Subject: Clones In light of all this flaming about clones, I feel I should send in a story I heard recently. There was this very famous lecturer, who, being so famous, was very much in demand. As a result, he was making megabucks. However, he was so booked up, that soon he had no time for anything else other than lecturing. Still, he didn't want to give up any lectures, even when he nearly suffered a complete physical collapse. His agent pointed out to him, at this point, that he couldn't go on like that, and suggested he have a clone of himself made. It would solve all his problems: he could make as much money as before, and only do half the work. So the lecturer went to MIT and had them make a clone of him. Well, this worked out fine at first, but after a few weeks something began to go wrong. The clone started telling off color stories and became increasingly obscene. The lecturer tried to stop this, and for awhile he seemed to be succeeding, when, one evening, he got a call from Harvard telling him that they would never allow him to speak there again, after the foul and abusive language he used. The lecturer rushed to Boston and went up to his clone's hotel room, on the 15th floor of the Hyatt. He started speaking to the clone out on the balcony. Their conservation soon grew violent, and he hit the clone, knocking him off the balcony, to his death 15 stories below. Of course the police tried to arrest him, but they couldn't find a charge that would stick. Murder was out since the clone was him and he was still alive. Suicide was also out for the same reason. But a smart DA found a charge that would stick: making an obscene clone fall. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 9:53:03 CST (Friday) From: Jeff Bowles Subject: ROTJ I especially enjoyed the material from the person at Rand-Relay who said something about the Emperor's daughter being the new hope. Ridiculous as it sounds, I have heard it before from someone who claimed to have "the inside story". (This person also claimed that Boba Fett is a good guy, and was taking Han away to revive him.) I don't know WHO the "other" is. I suppose that it's somebody we haven't met, and suspect that it's Luke's son. Probably the Vader/Luke conflict will end (with Vader's timely demise) in ROTJ. We can only hope... How does Lucasas plan to hide the advances in technology from the movie- goers ? It would be a real problem if the first movie (the one which has Obi-wan and Darth and Luke's Father and Leia's father and the clones) has NEAT NEW weapons that outclass things in Star Wars, which happens about 30 years later. Jeff ------------------------------ Date: 3 December 1982 21:27-EST From: Charles F. Von Rospach Subject: The other... At Octocon, they did a slide show on ROTJ. It was stated specifically that Obi does NOT return. There was one slide in which he appeared, and they were very careful to say that he would be adding the 'ghosting' affect to him in the final print. It was about the only specific thing they said at the showing, so I doubt obi-wan will return. It isn't 'klone' wars, or 'clone' wars, but colon wars. And it isn't colon for colonial. Someone stole the Emporer's Milk of Magnesia, and Vader (not Vadar or VADER) is his personal physician. chuck (chuqui at mit-mc) HAven't we pushed the cloning about as far is it will go? From the previous movies, I think it is rather safe to say that the answers will much much simpler than the tri-level cloning/father/mother/sister/wookie mixtures that have been showing up... ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 1:51:22 EST (Friday) From: David Mankins Subject: T'other I think the other hope is Paul Muad D'ib, who will come riding a sand-worm out of the deserts of Tatooine, leading a pack of Fremen to take over the galaxy, replacing Zen with Islam as the dominant philosophy in the Star Wars mythology. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Nov 82 8:34:06-PST (Tue) From: decvax!microsof!fluke!vax1.witters at Ucb-C70 Subject: Star Wars, The Empire Strikes Back, Radio Series I received the following notice in the mail from the local public radio station: The STAR WARS saga continues on public radio! Beginning Valentine's day 1983, listeners will thrill to the roar of terrifying ice beasts, the crash and fire of lightsaber duels -- and the quiet wisdom of wizened old Jedi master Yoda -- when National Public Radio presents an all new, exclusive 10-part radio series based on the record-breaking film sequel. The series stars Mark Hamill as Luke Skywalker, Anthony Daniels as See Threepio, and Billy Dee Williams as Lando Calrissian. Academy Award winning music and sound effects add to the excitement! Produced by National Public Radio in association with KUSC-FM Los Angeles, and with the cooperation of Lucasfilm Ltd. I received this from KUOW, Seattle, Washington. I suspect the series will also be broadcast by KPLU, Tacoma Washington. Perhaps the radio series will give some more clues as to who "The Other" is. For those who don't know, Valentine's day falls on Monday, February 14, 1983. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 0221-PST From: Henry W. Miller Subject: Re: The Other, etc. On the same hand, did you note that the term DEATH STAR was not used in the first movie? -HWM ------------------------------ Date: 3-Dec-82 2:21PM-EST (Fri) From: David Miller Subject: RotJ the Other etc... Allright, I wanted to keep it a secret, but I can't stand seeing anymore of this mindless speculation. THINK! The Other is supposed to appear at the end of the next movie, then s/he will not be seen again until episode VII. Episode VII is supposed to take place a while after RotJ, and will certainly not be filmed less than ten years afterwards. So you want a character that can be played by one actor in the next film, and a different one years from now. In the series this could be done by having it be another masked figure, but that would have to be a totally new character, and I don't think Lucas is going to introduce anybody out of the blue. Perhaps if it was a child in RotJ then s/he could be all grown in the later films? Yah that sounds pretty good, but where would a child come from in this series... maybe that shot of Leia immediately after the discussion of Ben and Yoda about the other did mean something! Maybe Leia will have a child by ? [pick one: Luke, Han] Sorry the correct answer is Vader. Vader will have another son by Leia. What How??? Well remember that scene on Bespin where Han is thrown in to the cage with Chewie, and says "I feel Terrible" well a minute later Leia is thrown in. Her makeup is smeared for the first time ever, she has changed clothes, she is very depressed, but seemingly unhurt, yet says in anguish "Why are they doing this?" Han on the other hand, is in terrible pain, is wearing his old clothes, and also depressed. Leia's torture seems reasonably obvious though not explicitly stated for reasons of the movie's rating. ****Spoiler**** The final scene of RotJ is Leia and Han being chased by stormtroopers, they come across a wandering Ricardo Montalban and his traveling zoo of primitive primates. Leia gives Ricardo the baby, the couple runs on and eventually get gunned down. Ricardo hides the baby in the chimpanzee cage, where it utters the word "mama". ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 1982 10:44:52 EST (Friday) From: Bernie Cosell Subject: Omega Glory Recitation I thought that the document was the Constitution ("We the people...") and not the Pledge of Allegiance ("I pledge allegiance to the flag...") /Bernie ------------------------------ Date: 3 Dec 82 14:10:54 EST (Fri) From: Grumpy Subject: st: episodes and movie Concerning the episode 'Miri'; the show started off with them running around and wondering why in the hell there was a copy of Earth way out here in an unexplored sector of the galaxy? ("It's the same mass, the same proportion of water to land, the same atmosphere composition, even the continents are EXACTLY the same as Earth!") They even mentioned that there had never been a colony out here, or anything, yet they used an Earth-style SOS signal. Unfortunately, after the first 15 min, all that wondering about the peculiar situation is lost in the scurry for a cure to the dreaded 'grups' disease, and is never picked up again. Seemed to me that SOMEONE had a solution in mind, but they ran out of time or money, or inspiration. Of course, this is far from the only inconsistency in Star Trek; shall we make a list? (a good one is: why didn't they use the shuttle when the transporter was broken? In many episodes this was the logical solution, but was never thought of, e.g. in the episode "The Enemy Within" (or something like that) where Kirk is split into his good and bad halves, and they try to fix him before the people on the planet freeze to death. On the first ST movie: it did have it's good points, one of them being Spock's transformation. (If you get Starlog, you know all about this.) He learned something about himself, and was a better man for it. I think the movie was really his story, only it was a minor part of the special effects and the rest of the 'plot'. Of course, being so changed he HAD to die in the next movie. (Anyone familiar with the Heroic tradition?) (just like Boromir and Frodo and other, more traditional heros, whom I can't remember) ------------------------------ End of SF-LOVERS Digest *********************** Brought to you by Super Global Mega Corp .com