From: utzoo!utcsrgv!donald
Newsgroups: net.religion
Title: potency and free will again
Article-I.D.: utcsrgv.1264
Posted: Sun Apr 10 14:50:21 1983
Received: Sun Apr 10 15:16:56 1983

Re: Ralph's argument for free will:

   			... I think it involves VOLUNTARY relinquishing
    of CONTROL on His part. Thus WE choose, and although he can KNOW what we
    will choose, it is OUR choice and thus responsibility. And this is where
    I think your analogy with the LISP program doesn't hold. You are in full
    control at all times.

What you are calling "free will" is only our own ignorance of the future.
You admit that God can see everything in the future.  If there is anything
for him to see, that must mean that we're all puppets.  Otherwise there'd
be nothing for him to see, and we'd have true free will, but then God can't
see the future!
NOW, The fact that God created the universe means that not only are we all
puppets, but we're HIS puppets.

That's why I say that if God is both all-knowing and all-powerful, then
He's not loving or merciful-- He's just a puppet master having his jollies.

I'll grant you that God can voluntarily relinquish control, in the sense
that once he sets a configuration of matter and energy going, he lets
it continue unmolested (aside: a "miracle" by definition would then be
an occasion where he molests the evolution of the initial configuration).

But, unlike me and my LISP program, if He knows everything that's going to
happen for any initial configuration, then everything that happens is
His fault.  Just like if I know that my own LISP program craps out at 00000666
then it's my fault.


				This is my last try at explaining this! :-)
				Don Chan