From: utzoo!decvax!microsof!fluke!vax1:swifty
Newsgroups: net.suicide
Title: Re: Continuing a lengthy flame
Article-I.D.: vax1.301
Posted: Thu Apr 14 06:52:54 1983
Received: Fri Apr 15 20:19:34 1983
References: mit-eddi.109


I have been reading this newsgroup ever since I learned about the
net and for the first time (almost) the seeds of an important
discussion have appeared.
I have the opportunity of knowing and being a friend of someone
who is extremely suicidal.  I have learned that all the standard
answers like "look what you've got...", etc. are useless when
helping.  You have to be comfortable with not being able to
explain why you want to live. Hamilton is correct, because
the only way you can help, if that is your goal, is to show the
person in trouble that you care.  To show you care you have to
be prepared to be hurt.  You have to be prepared to fail and
it will hurt.  I've been on the phone trying to convince my friend
to stay on the line while I have the medics called by someone else.
Talking with someone who has overdosed on sleeping pills and listening
to them fade away as the emergency team worries about which county
they are responding to. Up to that day I had been giving that friend
the standard "bullshit" about living, the good things to look forward
to, "think about those who love you," etc. It is really all a bunch of
garbage.  What you have to show them is that you have a purpose for your
life.  I don't think that there can be any other purpose than to
help other people, to make the world a better place to be.
	This doesn't mean that you have to go around hugging
every person you see, but it does mean that you must learn and
utilize you talents to the best of your ability.  You must be 
prepared to bare you feelings.  I agree that you don't need to listen
to the soap opera of someones troubles, but listening nevertheless
can help.  Be prepared to be used.  Be prepared to be hated.  If
you are trying to help someone in a suicidal situation the feeling
(s) are so intense that pain will come easily.  I suspect that
some of you will now respond by saying that I'm trying to get
something for myself, or that I am being a egoist (that's the
right word, look it up).  You are right.  I cannot claim to do
anything for the world if I can't do anything for myself. All I
can hope is that the things I do to help the person in need and
to help myself will provide some benefit to the earth and
the people in it.  I cannot hope to succeed if I wait until
I know that what I'm doing is the right and best thing.
	Today is the 18th birthday of my friend.  She has
announced to the world that she will not live past this date.
I am convinced that we have built a shield around her so she
won't try anything today, but I am also convinced that she will
eventually succeed in her desire to die.  I probably will fail
to keep her alive, but I haven't failed in my goal of helping people.
Through her, I have met several others who were on the edge.  They
are no longer there. But above all I have learned to not be afraid of
baring my innermost feelings.  When it all is analysed the only
thing that really matters is love.  If you flame back at me asking
what that means, I won't be able to answer.  I do know, however, that
I love my young friend and she knows that I do.  I cannot offer anymore
than myself and love forms the framework of the relationship. 
She will not die knowing she is alone; she will choose to die knowing
there are people out there who love her.  It might eventually help
her to change her mind.  No matter what happens that love will be there
and the world will be a little better for it.
	In summary, (how does one summarize rambling?):  Give yourself
to whatever limit you think you can.  Do not hold back.  Do not be
afraid of the hurt and pain.  If you hold back anything the person
in need will see right through.  Do not analyse the person; they
probably get enough of that already.  Learn to love and share your
innermost feelings.  It's hard but the learning is worth the effort.
Above all, be true to yourself and let the other person see within
you. 
	I realize that this has been somewhat incoherent and rambling
but I've not really sorted out my own feelings.  I read this newsgroup
in hope that I'll gain some insight.  One good article is worth all
the other crap.  Thanks to those who try to keep this group alive.

I, too, have been called:
The eternal optimist and the incorrigible romantic (by my friend)

Steve Swift
..microsof!fluke!swifty