From: utzoo!decvax!harpo!eagle!mhtsa!alice!npoiv!npois!hou5f!hou5b!hou5c!hou5e!mat
Newsgroups: net.unix-wizards
Title: Re: Rand Editor
Article-I.D.: hou5e.367
Posted: Wed Apr 13 10:27:51 1983
Received: Fri Apr 15 04:28:33 1983
References: flairvax.105

(Flame on!)
    ``Turning tabs into spaces is a feature, not a bug....''

  I suppose that this depends on you notion of what a tab is.  If
you view a tab as a command to the editor to adjust your current
position by space--padding, well, yes, then it IS a feature.  To me,
the tab is a character (HT, octal value 011, in ASCII) and I would
like the editor to be able to handle it as such.  The fact that this
character has an effect on your output device should effect the way
the editor displays the character, not on the way it stores it.  Would
you want you ``carriage return'' key to fill in enouch spaces to make your
terminal wrap around?

    ``Do you really like it when you're inserting text into tab-infested
    whitespace and you can't type where you want because there's no "there"
    there ?''

  Well, I have no problem using vi ... typing a couple of extra spaces isn't
THAT hard.  And since most of my tab usage is for either indentation or
for writing tables (of initialized structures) I find tabs a VERY good way
to quickly accomplish my ends.  In fact, I would like a key that would
produce two or three of them!

    ``...or when trailing characters jump spasmodically when you type
    the character that pushes it to the brink of the next tabstop ?''

  Sounds like some tabs were used where tabs were not appropriate.  In
editing tables, this is perfectly acceptable.  But WHAT are you doing
stuffing tabs into the middle of text?

    ``On the other hand, why the Rand editor doesn't properly compress
    my whitespace into tabs where possible is beyond my comprehension...''

Hmm, now I begin to understand why a program I received for maintanance
had ****ing tabs placed where there should have been spaces.  Single
spaces in mid--text were replaced with tabs when the space lay on top of
a tabstop.  Must have been some brain--damaged editor.

    ``When I enter text, whitespace is whitespace is whitespace, tabs are
    just a fast way to enter spaces up to the next tabstop.''

  Well, what you need is a key that will enter multiple spaces.  Of course,
what you are looking for is an electronic emulator for a typewriter, with
its tabulating properties.  I agree that this could be useful, but it is
not the standard usage of the HT character.

    ``The number of (badly conceived) programs that distinguish tabs
    from spaces is pitifully small. I'll use vi, I guess, in those cases.''

  As I have already indicated, tabs are exteremly valuable for a small
set of extremely common (>98% of my work) situations.  True, both are
considered whitespace by MANY but not all programs ( eg SORT(I) and (CUT(I))
because in these programs it is useful for humans to organize the inputs
with tabs.  This organization (program indentation, etc) is not important
to these programs, and so they ignore it.

  In short, if you have a need for a tabulator on your keypad, whether
hardware or software, please feel free to invent it and use it.  Please do
not complain that a DIFFERENT mechanism, which works quite well in its
current use, is not just exactly what you need.

(Flame off!)
						Mark Terribile
						(Duke of deNet)
						-!hou5e!mat