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From: pc@hplabsb.UUCP (Patricia Collins)
Newsgroups: net.women
Subject: no men need apply
Message-ID: <1802@hplabsb.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 24-Aug-83 17:00:17 EDT
Article-I.D.: hplabsb.1802
Posted: Wed Aug 24 17:00:17 1983
Date-Received: Fri, 26-Aug-83 09:25:19 EDT
Organization: Hewlett Packard Labs, Palo Alto CA
Lines: 53


	The temptation to find a support group wherever one can is
STRONG.  However, I propose that, rather than request a haven, safe
from those who might not share our concerns, we attempt to carry on
what candid, thoughtful, and sensitive communication we can in the
midst of the noise.

	Although I normally don't like to point out the obvious, 
please note that the preceding paragraph contains no reference to
gender.  One cannot even assume who "we" refers to (beyond those who
have common concerns...related to "women").  This may require a kind
of strength and fortitude since one may be subjected to insensitive,
unsympathetic attacks in response to an implied request for understanding
and support.  Women have been counselled that this is a new era
where we must join with men of similar mind to get what we want.

	I would guess that topics which have been avoided include:

	(1) What should "I" do the next time my male colleague decides
	to grab first and ask questions later?  (Note: Anyone whose
	reply starts by trying to find out what "I" did wrong is
	probably not in the "understanding and supportive" category.)

	(2) Are there any Young Women's Networks out there?  How do
	they work?

	(3) When it is "given" that "my" immediate management thinks
	women are best at support tasks and implementation details,
	is there any hope for getting that creative design job?

	(4) Despite "my" refusal to buy into the SuperWoman Myth,
	"I" now find "myself" balancing a job, homemaking, parenting,
	spousal emotional support, financial planning,...and what is
	noticeably missing is time for "my" friendships with women (i.e.,
	"my" support).  Is anyone finding a way to "do it all?"  
	Is there any way out of the Myth?

	(5) The subtle discrimination is sometimes the worst kind.
	Is there a way to combat condescension without resorting to
	confrontation?  

Perhaps we can start fresh.  Peer pressure can be powerful.  I'm
more than willing to IGNORE blatantly hostile attacks and to respond 
thoughtfully to those who offer support OR a sensitively stated 
alternative view.  

	One of the lessons of the ERA effort is this: not all women
are sensitive supporters of other women and not all men are insensitive
misogynists.

						Patricia Collins
						hplabs