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From: edhall%rand-unix@sri-unix.UUCP
Newsgroups: net.unix-wizards
Subject: Re:  Your flame about Unix philosophy...right on target.
Message-ID: <11984@sri-arpa.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 29-Sep-83 02:56:00 EDT
Article-I.D.: sri-arpa.11984
Posted: Thu Sep 29 02:56:00 1983
Date-Received: Wed, 28-Sep-83 19:54:22 EDT
Lines: 61

I quote from your letter:

>>  I realize this is heresy to say things like this. You'll probably point
>>  out that I wouldn't have even be able to read your message if it wasn't
>>  for fine Unix software. On the other hand, I will point out that many
>>  systems are capable of Unix-like functionality, except that they are
>>  lacking a certain sexy user interface. On the other hand, they are
>>  reliable, well documented, maintainable, and supported. By a responsive
>>  and responsible group of people. THEY answer their telephone, which is
>>  more than I can say for Berkeley.
>>
>>  How long is this community going to put up with this utter piece of
>>  software trash?

My first reaction is to ask you why in the world you wish to make such
complaints in `Unix-Wizards'?  Seems a bit out of place, no?

It's a bit late, and your miasmal letter just rubbed me the wrong way.
I'm still trying to figure out if you merely want to vent your spleen
over something--anything--or if you really do have some valid criticisms.
In the former case, I guess it's better than kicking the dog.  But if
you really feel that UNIX is so very, very bad that it mystifies you
as to how any sentient being can tolerate it, let's hear some specifics.

Here is a list of questions for you:

1) Is the UNIX software really that unreliable compared to other systems?

1a) Which systems are better?

(Your experience here seems atypical--I've seen 4.1BSD systems run for
weeks, even months, continuously without breakdown or problem.)

1b) What are some of these bugs that have bitten you so bad?

2) Is UNIX *that* unstructured?

2a) What do you mean by `structured'?

2b) Which systems are better structured?

3) Is the UNIX documentation so incredibly worse than other systems?

3a) Which other systems?

4) Did you really expect Berkeley to provide free consulting?

4a) What vendors/systems provide such free consulting?

(If you have a System III/V -flavored UNIX you can pay for full support
from AT&T.  Other consulting firms support BSD UNIX.  Berkeley is a
University, not a software vendor/consultant.)


...and so on and so forth.  Constructive criticism is appreciated more
than the other kind.  I'll leave it to others to answer you point-by-
point, if they find anything more than innuendo.  I don't have the time.

		-Ed Hall
		edhall@rand-unix
		decvax!randvax!edhall