Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1exp 10/6/83; site ihnss.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!security!genrad!decvax!harpo!floyd!clyde!ihnp4!ihnss!warren From: warren@ihnss.UUCP (Warren Montgomery) Newsgroups: net.emacs Subject: Re: EMACS Usage Message-ID: <1782@ihnss.UUCP> Date: Wed, 2-Nov-83 17:30:48 EST Article-I.D.: ihnss.1782 Posted: Wed Nov 2 17:30:48 1983 Date-Received: Sun, 6-Nov-83 07:24:17 EST References: <6010@cca.UUCP> kobold.190 <6027@cca.UUCP> Organization: AT&T Bell Labs, Naperville, Il Lines: 63 I didn't see the origin of this discussion, but I have a lot of data on editor use at BTL, collected from examining accounting files, rather than any personal knowledge of the users. It certainly isn't a scientific study, nor does it include data for all of the machines at BTL. It is, however, based on the data from about 150 different machines, and is remarkably consistent over the last year. In general, it reveals that of the screen editor uses, vi is about 2/3, emacs (mostly mine, some Gosling's) is about 1/3, with small amounts of others. This isn't surprising, since vi is more generally supported and has been around longer than any of the various flavors of emacs. Ed is invoked more commonly than everything else put together, but I suspect that a lot of this is due to batch usage of ed, as in shell scripts or various other tools that do a little bit of editing as part of a larger task. The data shows strong pockets of users of one sort of an editor or another. Some machines show all emacs and no vi, some all vi and no emacs, and some neither. In selecting an editor, I agree completely with the perception that editor preference is largly a religion once an editor is used. In my 15 years of computing, I have used the "retype the line by line-number" editor used in BASIC systems, an ed style editor, and Emacs. Each transition was a bitter battle for me to accept a new way of doing things. I was one of the last people in my group to make the transition to Emacs, but became a true believer. My perception is, however, that conversions are relatively rare, and in general people stick with the editor they know and love unless you take it away. (When I left MIT and lost access to Emacs, I re-invented it rather than learn vi or go back to ed.) In making the initial choice, I would think that the following reflects what influences people most: 1) A local Guru. This is why you see pockets of use. One organization will have an emacs Guru that shows each new user how to set up initialization sequences and patiently explains all of the commands to people in their organization. Another will have a vi Guru doing the same. 2) Official Support. Some people don't like experimental things. 3) Personal stye. My perception is that emacs/vi use may correlate with other aspects. People who compose and edit completely on line, without ever producing paper are more likely to favor emacs, while those who write drafts or print paper copy and mark it up for later editing are more likely to favor vi. Some people are more comfortable with the push-a-button-and-watch-what-it-does style of emacs, while some favor a structured command oriented approach to human-machine interaction. I think that the quality of manuals is important in user statisfaction, but not critical in determining how users choose editors. Users are lazy and won't read the manual if the guy down the hall will answer the question for them. -- Warren Montgomery ihnss!warren IH x2494