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From: rlr@pyuxn.UUCP
Newsgroups: net.religion
Subject: Re: "Re: A Belated Reply to Paul Dubuc [from - (nf)"
Message-ID: <333@pyuxn.UUCP>
Date: Mon, 31-Oct-83 18:47:47 EST
Article-I.D.: pyuxn.333
Posted: Mon Oct 31 18:47:47 1983
Date-Received: Thu, 3-Nov-83 20:28:09 EST
References: <198@ihlpf.UUCP>
Organization: Bell Labs, Piscataway
Lines: 29

> Are the Christians out there saying that if there
> was no God they would have no compunctions about lying, cheating and
> stealing?  Is God the ONLY reason that Christians don't go on some murderous
> rampage?  Is the fear of God the ONLY thing that keeps Christians from
> robbing their neighbors?

It would seem that a fundamental principle of religionism (the belief in the
desire or need for a religion, esp. for all people) is a low opinion of human-
ity.  Without god, humankind is nothing.  Without god, people would only resort
to doing evil things and would have no reason to be "good".  Without god, there
would be no guidelines for us to live by.  Without god, our origins would be
ascribed to "natural" processes like evolution (GASP!), and our very existence
could only be based on pure chance (HORRORS!).  Therefore there must be a god.
(I just LOVE that last sentence.)

This is one reason why the notion of "humanism" is so frightening to religion-
ists; it promotes the idea of humans being in charge of their own destiny, as
far as their bodies and minds can take them, and not subject to the whims of
an incorporeal entity.  (The other reason that religionists fear humanism is
that such a belief, if widely held, would shake their power base out from under
them.)

A few questions for Christians and other religionists:  Why must there be a
god?  What is the difference between praying to god for help and helping
yourself?  (If the Lord helps those who help themselves, isn't prayer just
a methodology for getting yourself in the frame of mind to help yourself?)
What is wrong with the idea that, as long as I don't interfere in the rights
of other human beings, I should be free to live to my best potential as I
see fit?