Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!decvax!harpo!eagle!mhuxl!ulysses!unc!mcnc!ncsu!fostel From: fostel@ncsu.UUCP Newsgroups: net.ai Subject: Rational Psych Message-ID: <2416@ncsu.UUCP> Date: Mon, 28-Nov-83 18:53:46 EST Article-I.D.: ncsu.2416 Posted: Mon Nov 28 18:53:46 1983 Date-Received: Wed, 30-Nov-83 03:09:24 EST Lines: 34 Well, I hope this is the last time .... Again, I have been accused of ignorance; again the accustation is false. Its fortunate only my words can make it into this medium. I would appreciate the termination of this discussion, but will not stand by and be patronized without responding. All sane and rational people, hit the and go on to the next news item please. When I say psychologists do not do very good science I am talking about the exact same thing you are talking about. There is no escape. Those "rigorous" experiments sometime succeed in establishing some "facts", but they are sufficiently encumbered by lack of controls that one often does not know what to make of them. This is not to imply a critisism of psychologists as intellectually inferior to chemists, but the field is just not there yet. Is Linguistics a science? Is teaching a science? Laws (and usually morals) prevent the experiments we need, to do REAL controlled experiments; lack of understanding would probably prevent immediate progress even in the absence of those laws. Its a bit like trying to make a "scientific" study of a silicon wafer with 1850's tools and understanding of electronics. A variety of interesting facts could be established, but it is not clear that they would be very useful. Tack on some I/O systems and you could then perhaps allow the collection of reams of timing and capability data and could try to corrollate the results and try to build theories -- that LOOKS like science. But is it? In my book, to be a science, there must be a process of convergence in which the theories more ever closer to explaining reality, and the experiments become ever more precise. I don't see much convergence in experimental psychology. I see more of a cyclic nature to the theories .... ----GaryFostel---- P.S. There are a few other science which do not deserve the title, so don't feel signled out. Computer Science for example.