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From: martillo@ihuxt.UUCP (Yehoyaqim Shemtob Martillo)
Newsgroups: net.flame,net.women
Subject: Re: Re: Martillo's Rape Cure
Message-ID: <370@ihuxt.UUCP>
Date: Sat, 31-Mar-84 23:50:26 EST
Article-I.D.: ihuxt.370
Posted: Sat Mar 31 23:50:26 1984
Date-Received: Sun, 1-Apr-84 08:16:18 EST
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>	This will be my last chance to respond on this topic for ~1 month
>as our site is being pulled off the net to handle a sudden, acute loading
>problem.  Let me say that my comment about Libya, "male-dominated, repressive,
>inhibitive society" *was* a culturally chauvinistic statement.  However I do
>feel the same way the Jim Dyer does when he states that our culture has been
>much improved (I would say tremendously improved) due to the Women's Movement
>and to all people re-examining roles and behaviors that have been taken for
>granted for *too* long.  We still have a long way to go.  It is my hope that
>ultimately we will have a world society where the rights and privileges of
>all humans are equal and not based according to sex, race, religion, or any
>other arbitrary criterion. 

This last statement is typical Western exterminationist rhetoric.  I come
from a culture which emphasizes duties and responsibilities above rights
and privileges.  Don't we have a right to exist in the future?  The writer
seems to advocate world cultural homogeneity, but cultural diversity is
one of the nicer characteristics of this planet.

>	As far as extreme cultural chauvinism goes, I would say that the 
>statement "no American woman dresses modestly" certainly qualifies.  

I probably should have said:

	Almost no American woman dresses modestly by Islamic criteria.
	
By the way in Islamic societies, both men and women wear shapeless
clothing which covers almost all the body.  This dress prevents either men
or women from being considered sex objects.  Many Islamic Jurists have
explicitly stated that avoiding all sexual queues is the purpose of
Islamic dress.

>									As well
>as the recommendation of adapting one society's behaviors (which are based on
>a totally different cultural/religious milieu) to solve another society's 
>problems.

Despite all the nasty comments, I suspect there is far less rape in Libya
than in the USA (so much for the glory of American culture).  Americans
simply commit a disproportionate number of rapes. In 1966, I
lived in Salzburg in Austria (population ~110,000).  I remember talking
with a Salzbuergerin about the four rapes which occurred that year.  She
held Amerikanische Beeinfluessung (American influence) responsible.

>	Good for you and your scimitar!  I also deplore the cases where women
>(and men!) have been attacked in full view of witnesses where no-one has gone
>for help (let alone hacked the attacker to pieces).  If everyone carried weapons
>perhaps such things would not happen, but I do not like the idea of a society
>where such extreme resorts were necessary.  I much prefer changing the concept
>of "women as victim", both by raising women who do not think of themselves as
>such (the role-playing process starts early and it's crucial) and by enforcing
>*very* strict punishment for offenders. 

The rapist's desire to victimize is more important than the woman's self
image.

>					 One other comment - it is very 
>difficult for "all the men to grab their weapons and hack the attacker to 
>pieces" if the rape does not occur in public.  Most of them don't.

I saw an article which detested my opinions and stated the exact opposite.

For all of you who do not read Arabic and who are woefully ignorant of
Islamic society,  the big issue which educated Muslim women are addressing
is female circumcision  which is the removal or mutilation of the
clitoris.  The issues which American feminists discuss seem quite trivial
by comparison.