Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site pyuxn.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!gamma!pyuxww!pyuxn!rlr From: rlr@pyuxn.UUCP (Rich Rosen) Newsgroups: net.audio,net.music.classical,net.music Subject: Re: Tone deafness AND absolute pitch Message-ID: <636@pyuxn.UUCP> Date: Fri, 4-May-84 17:03:09 EDT Article-I.D.: pyuxn.636 Posted: Fri May 4 17:03:09 1984 Date-Received: Sat, 5-May-84 02:27:50 EDT References: <293@houxb.UUCP> pyuxn.632 <294@houxb.UUCP> Organization: Bell Communications Research, Piscataway N.J. Lines: 60 First, some nonsense, then on to more serious stuff... > Mr Rosen, the article on tone deafness was posted to net.audio > since there was a question in Mr DeBenedictis' article requesting > information on equalizers about his alleged tone deafness. My statement did not ask about why it *was* posted to net.audio... > I also posted it to net.music.classical. ...but instead asked why, when the article was posted to other newsgroups, net.music.classical was selected while net.music was not! Those who have unsubscribed to net.music have already missed an article or two (by others) that was not submitted to net.music.classical . On to substantive matters... > Your pitch identification ability is a form of relative pitch identification, > where you use memory as your referent. If your memory referent > did not shift, one could not tell the difference between your > skill and that of someone with absolute pitch. > The exact mechanism of absolute pitch is not known. It apparently > has to develop in early childhood, but has been shown to > be training dependent. People with absolute pitch can tell > whether a turntable is running only a semitone fast! The ability to tell if a turntable is running fast is one that I do have. I didn't get any special training in early childhood (didn't start piano lessons until age 8, and no special pitch recognition training was included). My ability in this area seems to stem only from what you refer to as memory referent relative pitch. If I succeeded in memorizing all the notes of the scale (not just C), would that be absolute (or perfect) pitch? I am at the point where I recognize some other notes instantly without doing a "context switch" to imagine an interval to C. I wonder if perfect pitch starts with the memorization of a reference note and expands to the point where all notes are instantly recognized. It's certainly true that instant recognition of entire chord harmonies is much more difficult than for single notes, and is acquired through both ear training and music theory learning. (Isn't it?) (I'm not trying to be contrary, just stating that my experience is quite different from that which you describe.) I really don't think that "absolute perfect pitch" is something unique to a small group of individuals; I think it's much more universal than we realize. Many people may not have the training to recognize individual notes and chords (or sequences of them) for what they are, but I tend to think they can be distinguished by most everyone. A professor of mine once pointed out that if all of that virtuoso piano music (Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff) written in C# minor or Db major were played in C min/maj, it just wouldn't sound the same. The "warmth" with which the keys are regarded may be subjective or conditioned, but the ability to distinguish them from C min/maj seems to be universal. Though the "untrained" ear may not have the knowledge to determine what is different, a difference *will* be detected. (Did those guys write in those guys just to show how good they were, playing in such a difficult key? Typical!) (Does anyone have microtonal perfect pitch? What about those people who can identify a classical recording just by *looking* at the record? Read "A Conversation with Einstein's Brain" by Doug Hofstadter in his book "The Mind's 'I'" for an interesting corollary.) -- Never ASSUME, because when you ASSUME, you make an ASS out of U and ME... Rich Rosen pyuxn!rlr