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From: chrisp@oliven.UUCP
Newsgroups: net.flame
Subject: ranting, etc.
Message-ID: <145@oliven.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 24-May-84 15:34:02 EDT
Article-I.D.: oliven.145
Posted: Thu May 24 15:34:02 1984
Date-Received: Fri, 1-Jun-84 03:28:12 EDT
Organization: Olivetti ATC, Cupertino, Ca
Lines: 50

>>we can all think of material wealth that goes to people who don't do any
>>productive labor: 
>>	inheritance	all right, by the definition it's the right of the
>>			person who owned to give it away, but this once
>>			transferred, if we continue to follow this definition
>>			it is not the right of the inheritor to keep it
>>	returns on investments
>>			there is no labor here, just money
>>	wages in service industries
>>			strictly speaking, workers in the service industries
>>			(cleaning services, for example) do not produce
>>			anything
>>Lisa Chabot

By the definition of "productive labor" that you appear to be using you should
have included yourself (and me, for that matter) in your list of strictly not
productive. To beat up your examples:

	inheritance	you pretty well gave away your own argument. Note,
			however, that the recipients generally either use the
			inherited wealth to build something new, or more, etc.
			or throw it all away on high living. The situation is
			usually self-correcting.
	returns on investments
			if you really think that there is no labor involved in
			this catagory you are pretty damn ignorant! I am sure
			there are exceptions, but as a general rule quite a lot
			of homework and patience goes into producing a return on
			investment. And it isn't JUST money. Money is a tool,
			every bit as much as a monkey wrench or a welding torch
			or a VAX.
	wages in service industries
			if you really think that there is no productivity in
			this classification, try doing without any janitorial
			services in your office for a few weeks. How
			"productive" is it for you to do without your car the
			next time it stops running. How "productive" is it for
			you to have to go to the "producer" for the next item
			of clothing you want or the next loaf of bread you want
		 	to eat? You are going to tell me that the truckers,
			warehouswers, distributers and retailers don't "produce"
			anything?

The assinine idea that you are not being "productive" if you are not actually
assembling something with your hands (which is the root of your argument) has
been fostered over the last century by unscrupulous politicians chasing votes
and labor union organizers. Like most big lies, sufficient repetition has been
enough to get most people to buy the drivel.

Chris Prael