Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1.1 9/4/83; site scc.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!akgua!sdcsvax!sdcrdcf!hplabs!pesnta!scc!steiny From: steiny@scc.UUCP (Don Steiny) Newsgroups: net.nlang Subject: Re: Any new irregular verbs? Message-ID: <168@scc.UUCP> Date: Mon, 21-May-84 19:27:21 EDT Article-I.D.: scc.168 Posted: Mon May 21 19:27:21 1984 Date-Received: Wed, 23-May-84 19:38:59 EDT References: <49700001@hpfcra.UUCP> Organization: Santa Cruz Computer, Aptos, Calif. Lines: 77 *** Irregular verbs are fossels. They verbs contain the vowel gradations of Proto Indo-European. They are not abbrevations. The only way that a new one could occur is by leveling with an existing paradigm. For instance, "sing" "sang" "sung" "bring" "brought" "brung" Children often make this mistake. English only has two verb tenses, present and past. If a new verb is introduced in English, its past tense is formed by adding either a "t" sound or a "d" sound depending on the the final sound of the verb stem. For instance, "grok" in Heinlein's "Stranger in a Strange Land." The past tense is "groked". The intuition that irregular verbs are commonly used words is correct. That is why they remain irregular. English does not mark the distinction between subject an object on the nouns except in the case of pronouns. We need to say "she" in the subject position and "her" in the object position. "her saw she" is NOT English. In Old English EVERY noun was marked as subject or object. English changed so that this relationship was indicated by word order, but the inflections remained on pronouns for exactly the reason that they are so commonly used. Suppose we say that there are n verbs in English. For each verb we must have a present and a past. In the worst case there is a third ending, the preterate. For instance: "eat" "ate" "eaten" Even in the simpler case of "bring" - "brought", we must have two distinct words stored for each verb. Therefore we must store at least 2*n distinct words. The figure is closer to 3*n. On the other hand, adding a single ending to indicate past or preterate means that we will have exactly n+1 items to store. Though such a blatant analogy to computers might be overkill, many of us who has tried to learn vocabularies of a new language find the idea of a single rule that would cut the number of words we had to memorize in third so appealing that we might be tempted to call it "simpler". No one knows "why" language changes. By whose standards should we judge the "simplicity" of a language. Russian has an incredibly complex inflectional system, basically, their language went the direction of more inflections. There is prefered word order in Russian, but in some cases, any word order will suffice. That means that if you are going to learn Russian you will have to learn many endings that are used in many circumstances. Many English speakers find this difficult. On the other hand a Russian learning English might be frustrated because there is no indication of subject/object relationship on the nouns, no future tense, and so on. The "simplist" language is the one you learned as a child. English is a strange and wonderful language. Surprisingly its syntax is closer to Chinese than it is to its Indo-European relatives. Many of its irregularities are historical records. They mark the history of the people that used the language and the marks are often records of events that happened long before English was a gleam in Proto-Germanic's eye. A good introduction to the history of the English language is Pyles': "The Origns and Development of the English Language." Don Steiny Personetics