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From: saquigley@watmath.UUCP (Sophie Quigley)
Newsgroups: net.singles
Subject: Re: thoughts on desperation
Message-ID: <7865@watmath.UUCP>
Date: Sat, 26-May-84 22:18:29 EDT
Article-I.D.: watmath.7865
Posted: Sat May 26 22:18:29 1984
Date-Received: Thu, 31-May-84 20:33:43 EDT
References: <706@pucc-h>, <973@hao.UUCP>, <723@pucc-h>
Organization: U of Waterloo, Ontario
Lines: 71

From  Jeff Sargent:

> Analyze yourself.  Be honest (brutally honest at times) with
> yourself.  Find out what feelings (or actually, what erroneous beliefs about
> yourself) are keeping you from going out and making friends with those
> MOTOS's.  Decide to stop believing those erroneous beliefs; recognize them
> for the destructive lies that they are, and change your mind.  The cause for
> your desperation is not that your body and emotions have not received what
> they desire.  The ultimate cause is that you have (for whatever reason) not
> believed it possible for them to receive what they desire.
> 
> Another example of this, which I have just realized, faced, and dealt with,
> and which I also offer in the hope that it might help some other readers:
> I felt that I was not really a man.  Oh, of course I have the appropriate
> physical characteristics; but I felt that I wasn't really a man INSIDE.  I camefrom a background not calculated to make one grow up feeling strongly male: my
> parents divorced when I was 8; and my mother, who got custody of me, was (or
> at least I perceived her as) domineering.  I've just been reading a book
> ("Eros Defiled", by John White) in which it is mentioned that those who grow
> up in such backgrounds may become what is known as "pseudohomosexuals" --
> i.e. men who may have some characteristics of homosexuals and/or lack some of
> the characteristics of normal heterosexuals, who are more likely to have
> homosexual feelings and be vulnerable to homosexual temptation than most
> males, but who are not practicing homosexuals.	I certainly ended up this way;
> I've never had a homosexual experience, but I've sometimes wanted males all
> too strongly.  Anyway, the neat turnaround in my case was that my desire for a
> really good woman as friend and lover -- the desire around which all my
> frustration had been built -- came to my aid!  I realized that there is one
> young woman I know whom I have been attracted to and cared about for some
> months, not because she is a generic woman (I know, there's no such thing)
> who could heal my "disease" and cure my problems, but because she is a good
> companion, being an intelligent, sensitive, talented, and beautiful woman.
> (And to top it off, I'm not sure if she believes that she's attractive!  So I
> have some compassion for her too.)  In other words, realizing that I had a
> desire which was a normal male desire, not based on sickness and pain, enabled
> me to know that yes, I too am a real man!  [Then why do I like quiche? :-)]

Oh my god!  nobody has taken that one up yet!  Jeff Please!! I'd like to
suggest that you really apply the counsels you give us to yourself, especially
the ones about not accepting those erroneous beliefs and realising how dangerous
they are.  Why in the world do you have to equate homosexual feelings with
"not being a man"?  (what is a "man" anyway?) why are your desires for women
"normal" and your desires for men "based on sickness and pain"?  Has your God
really told you that some of those of those desires are bad and the others good?
Are you sure that you haven't been fooled by people rather than God into
believing such things?  people have said many things in the name of God to
suit their own little purposes and not necessarily for the good of others.  As
you seem to be in very close contact with your God, you should really make sure
that he REALLY disproves of those homosexual feelings you have before you
reject them as "sick" and throw yourself at women instead because you think it
is the "right" thing to do (I am wildly paraphrasing you here, and could be
completely wrong in my interpretation of your words).  If your God is a god of
Love as you say he is, he might accept many different types of Love, and if he
doesn't why doesn't he?  you should also ask him that. 

Your words make it sound as though you are interested in relationships with
women only so that they can "save" you from your desires for men.  If that is
so, that doesn't sound very good for the woman you will have a relationship with
Shouldn't she deserve to be loved for who she is rather than because she is
"saving" you from other people you love?  And if you love other people and they
also love you, wouldn't you all be more happy just loving each other rather
than trying to pretend you don't?  This sounds like I am pushing you to lead a
homosexual life; yes and no, I think you should just make sure that you are
not interested in heterosexual relationships just to avoid homosexual relation-
ships, and if you are, then maybe reconsider your choice.  I am not alone in
thinking that it is possible to be both a Christian and homosexual (I can look
up some references for you if you are interested).

Go in peace.

Sophie Quigley
...!{clyde,ihnp4,decvax}!watmath!saquigley