Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site abnjh.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!decvax!ittvax!dcdwest!sdcsvax!akgua!whuxle!spuxll!abnjh!cbspt002 From: cbspt002@abnjh.UUCP Newsgroups: net.crypt Subject: Re: Beale Cypher rebuttal (long) Message-ID: <740@abnjh.UUCP> Date: Sat, 14-Jul-84 18:23:08 EDT Article-I.D.: abnjh.740 Posted: Sat Jul 14 18:23:08 1984 Date-Received: Mon, 16-Jul-84 05:13:04 EDT References: <152@oakhill.UUCP> Organization: ATTIS, NJ Lines: 84 Ed Rupp replies to some of the evidence against the Beale Ciphers being legit in his article. I reply to his rebuttal (for at least those points which I am responsible). >Legalities. > I'll worry about legalities when I crack the cyphers. :-) No problem, I just thought you'd like to know of some of the headache of finding them. It may not be worth all the fame! >Why is B2 the easiest to crack? > Because it doesn't contain information that is sensitive. No sensitive info? Well, I don't know why talking about a hoarde of gold would be 'sensitive' (sarcasm). If you found it, would you give a 'parts list' of the hoarde to the NY Times? How about your local 'Holiday Inn' manager? Seriously, arent most treasure maps MAPS, with only tantalizing hints of the treasure? Of course, there's no reason to expect 'TJ' to follow any logical course, since logical activity goes out the window when you're talking megabucks (or at least they were in those days...). >Why is B2 so verbose? > As mentioned by another author, "Telegraphese wasn't invented until > the telegraph!" Besides this, the time involved gave Beale plenty > of opportunity to encode the messages. He had (at least) > from January 1822 to the spring (March?) to work on the cyphers > while staying at Morriss' inn. 'Verbose' is one thing, just-plain-odd use of language is another. His style is not only verbose and repetitive, but also seems anachronistic. You expect to find a 'thee' or 'thou' in the text, it's so (for lack of a better word) prosaic. By TJ's time, modern English had definitely taken hold. But, I have no better rebuttal to this objection to my objection, so call it an even match on this point. >Transporting gold/silver from Santa Fe. > What about river boats? Once you get to the Mississippi it > should have been easy to get to Virginia. > Also note what B2 says about exchanging some of the cargo for > jewels "to save transportation". Might this imply that they were > paying someone to move it for them? Security become a vast problem if we include 'movers' or any persons not in the raiding party. You know, "loose-lips", greed and all that... Granny: "Jethro, where'd you get that nugget 'o gold and that them there jewelery?" Jethro: "Oh, just some guys with a bunch of big boxes and shit eating grins had me take 'em up the river a spell..." Uncle Jed: "Boy, get me my gun, we is going huntin for some Virginians!" Jethro: "Why, yes sir uncle Jed, and I remember exactly where I left em off..." >Why does B2 reference B1 & B3? Maybe TJ just plain mis-numbered them or wrote and encoded them out of order. It would be in character! Actually the ordering can be satisfactorally explained. To wit, I think that TJ would've written the text B1 immediately after burying the treasure so not as to have to rely on a faulty memory, or if he went and died suddenly, or something like that. Then he would encode it first since it was written first, and not change the wording in it for reasons of accuracy. Now sometime later he writes B2, referring to an extant B1, and an as yet to be (or already) written B3. Then he numbers them wrong or in chronological order. QED But I'd still expect a READ ME FIRST message on top of B2. It may have been there, or maybe Ward just got lucky. Can you imagine him deciphering number 3 first: "Oh hell, just a bunch of names, & I was hoping for buried treasure or something. Oh well guess it'll make good fire-lighters..." -------end of rebuttals--------------------- I think it's a little futile employing arithmetical analysis to the search for an answer. Chances are you'd run into too damned many coincidences. Besides, I seriously doubt that TJB would have used math at all to encode. Perhaps the perponderance of mod 5 and mod 10 numbers is due to the fact that 5 and ten are pretty popular numbers (what with money and all that). (Don't get me wrong, real statistical analysis is another thing...) More through historical and sociological study is needed, especially to reveal a hoax in the case of the Beale ciphers. Unfortunately, the more of that what is applied to the Beale Ciphers, the MORE they seem like hoaxes! Marc Kenig, "not that I wouldn't be the first one to man a shovel and help ...abnjh!cbspt002 you dig if you DO figure it out...."