Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1.chuqui 4/7/84; site nsc.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!mhuxl!ihnp4!nsc!chuqui From: chuqui@nsc.UUCP (Chuq Von Rospach) Newsgroups: net.singles Subject: Re: pedestalization (and more) Message-ID: <1156@nsc.UUCP> Date: Sat, 7-Jul-84 03:44:14 EDT Article-I.D.: nsc.1156 Posted: Sat Jul 7 03:44:14 1984 Date-Received: Sun, 8-Jul-84 00:42:49 EDT References: <2082@mit-vax.UUCP> <778@pucc-h>, <791@bbncca.ARPA> <801@pucc-h> Organization: The Warlocks Cave Lines: 126 ->From Steve Dyer: - From Jeff Sargent From Uncle Chuqui -it is only natural to try any means available to make oneself feel -big, even if that means considering oneself a really big sinner. Jeff, what are you trying to prove, and to whom? The only person you need to prove anything to is yourself (and optionally your God). We don't care whether you are a good sinner or a bad sinner or whether you eat live hamsters for breakfast, all we care about is you. Are you trying to talk us into not wanting to care? Do you love rejection? If so, you should talk to someone about it. Negative feedback is worse than no feedback at all. I'd MUCH rather give positive feedback anyday. -Part of this -desire to overemphasize the darkness in me is from the idea of letting a woman -know the worst of me early on, so that if she's going to reject me, she'll do -it early. Oh, sigh. How many times do I have to say this? Give the other person a little chance at intelligence. I'm sure they can see your problems at least as well as you can without your million candlepower searchlight pointing it out. Have you ever thought that maybe your fears and problems, major crises they might be to you, simply aren't that important to her? You sound very self defeating here, as though you expect (and deep down inside, HOPE) to fail. I hope I'm wrong on that one... -since I never learned how to make a good impression on a -woman, all that's left is making a horrible one. The only person you REALLY make a horrible impression on is yourself. The spies I've planted at Purdue tell me you are a MUCH nicer person than you give yourself credit to be. (( Who knows the evil that lurks in the hearts of men (and women)? the plaid warlock knows... *bwa-ha-ha* You'll never know where he'll show up next...)) -It's true that it's a lot -more fun (and really safer) to do this than to humble myself before God and -ask Him to take away those things that keep me from considering myself a man -who would be attractive to anyone. Do you really consider mental self-abuse fun? (I won't get into the physical side-- no contest there... *grin*). Safer? Really? I hate to say this, Jeff, but that isn't altogether a healthy attitude. -You see, if I did this, I might find -myself inexorably drawn into loving a woman, and perhaps even into marriage; Sounds like heaven to me... Why do you insist on calling it hell? -and can anyone imagine anything more horrible than voluntarily imprisoning -oneself in a situation where one was committed to love another person, day in -and day out, year in and year out, whether one felt like it or not, until -death? Or, if you believe the Mormons, even after. Jeff, listen. There is no such thing as a voluntary prison (unless you count people who live in New Jersey). They can always leave. Current divorce statistics show that 1 out of three (and heading for 50%) of all marriages fail. You can leave. It takes about 8 months and under $300 dollars (in california, at least) and you don't even need a lawyer. Even the Catholics have come to realize that certain marriages weren't made in heaven, for Gawds sake. The one thing that IS worse than your voluntary prison is the one you are living in by not giving yourself a chance to find out what is really out there... -Obviously the above is a very jaundiced and fearful view of marriage. I would -be interested in the response from married readers of this group. As a soon-to-be-officially-ex-married person reading this group, as someone who has been on both sides and back again I think you are full of it. You have some serious misconceptions and fears about relationships, women, and marriage that go beyond the woeful limitations of this newgroup to help. At the least I think you should talk to your clergy about some of these fears, and possibly look for a counsellor. They are not rational, they are not reasonable, and they are seriously holding you back from developing into the kind of person your potential shows me you can be. -> This has been said before (but since when did that ever stop anyone?) -> Lighten up a bit! And, if these kind of ruminations bother you, have you -> considered seeing a psychologist? This is not meant to be gratuitous or -> mean, but a practical suggestion. Group therapy can be especially valuable -> because it focuses on the patterns of interaction and relationships between -> people in the group--very useful for people who have low self-images. - -How can one lighten up until one has solved the problems? If you were -concentrating terribly hard on a project, working 80 hours a week to finish -it as soon as possible, and making some progress, would not your boss (or -major professor, or whatever) prefer you to keep at it rather than lighten -up? How then ought I to lighten up in my work on this project? (Not to -mention the fact that I don't know how; it's almost impossible for me to -just relax with someone, unless that person is a very close friend.) There is such a thing as burnout, and any boss worth her salt will FORCE you to drop off the pace to keep you from going over the edge. The same can be said out of work situations where you get so involved with something you stop being able to produce positive effects. At that point you NEED to get someone in who can help you find a new perspective and a new angle of attack. -While I am somewhat coming to agree with you that some sort of therapy -(particularly group therapy) might help me, I wouldn't know where to find a -good psychologist, much less a group therapy group, in this jerkwater town. -You have to understand that this is a) Indiana, b) a small city (Lafayette) -therein; each of those factors sets the area back by at least half a century, -so this city is at least 100 years behind the times, unprovided with such -modern conveniences. Anyway, I distrust mind-bending figures such as -psychologists unless I either know them or have them recommended by someone -I trust. Perhaps I'll have to break down and go to a singles group run by a -local church, whose ads have mentioned something like "aiding personal growth -in an atmosphere of loving fellowship". It ain't easy to accept that God -might PREFER to help me through other people.... Hell, I happen to know that Purdue has a GOOD psych department. You trying to tell me a school of that caliber doesn't have a counselling center? you're attempting to justify your lack of action to yourself. I don't buy it. *sigh* -- From a hunting lodge for rich weirdos: Chuq Von Rospach {amd,fortune,hplabs,ihnp4}!nsc!chuqui (408) 733-2600 x242 Every single day, and every word you say, every game you play, every night you stay, I'll be watching you.