Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83 based; site homxa.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!mhuxl!houxm!homxa!gds From: gds@homxa.UUCP (Greg Skinner) Newsgroups: net.singles,net.women Subject: Re: Trish revisited, calmly Message-ID: <367@homxa.UUCP> Date: Sun, 26-Aug-84 12:22:03 EDT Article-I.D.: homxa.367 Posted: Sun Aug 26 12:22:03 1984 Date-Received: Mon, 27-Aug-84 00:34:52 EDT References: <1166@ihuxq.UUCP> Organization: AT&T Bell Labs, Holmdel NJ Lines: 87 > From: ken@ihuxq.UUCP (ken perlow) -- > >> From: aeq@pucc-h.UUCP (Jeff Sargent) ... > >> In other words, men are > >> looking for a woman to play the role of Christ in a visible, palpable > >> manner. As I read it, in Genesis 2:24, "For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and they will become one flesh." It doesn't seem to me that a man is looking for a woman to play the role of Christ in his life, rather that in finding that woman, *together* they can glorify God. It was God's idea that man should not be alone (Genesis 2:20) and that is why he made woman. > >> Anyway, returning to the theme of my earlier paragraphs, what would > >> seem to be necessary for marriage or SO-ship is that a man become > >> sufficiently accepting of his own and everyone else's > >> sins/imperfections that he can be intimate with a woman who is just > >> as sinful/imperfect as he is, and love her nevertheless. > >> My only question is: how on earth can anyone pull this off? I'm finding it hard to reply to this, because (1) I don't agree with it but (2) I don't really consider myself an authority on the subject, having never been married and not really having an SO (just occasional dates). I guess (to me) you become involved with someone because of mutual goals, similar likes and dislikes, companionship (as ken perlow has stated below) and some commitment to the relationship (as the relationship approaches marriage I guess the com- mitment gets stronger). I don't see how sins and imperfections have anything to do with it. > Oh, Jeff, Jeff, Jeff--you told us you were getting better. > Most of us with SO's desire them for companionship--you know, > warmth. Not for confession or psychoanalysis. Just to be with. > Such people are easy to find once you figure out that sinners > are intrinsically more interesting than saints. However, I do not agree with ken perlow's last statement. It seems to be a myth among non-Christians that Christians are boring people. Why do people think this way? (Reminds me of the line in "Only the Good Die Young" -- I'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints, the sinners are much more fun.) If going to prayer meetings or gospel concerts isn't your bag, don't do it and don't associate with people who do it! But don't label these people as *boring* just because they don't do the things you like to do, because their lives are just as fulfilled to them as yours are to you, and most Christians I've met do not feel that non-Christians lead dull lives, just different. > As for these sacrifices-of-the-saintly-purity-of-virginity > fantasies, Jeff, I think you've been reading too much lives of the > saints, who had woefully little experience in this area. This > "special honor", "blood sacrifice", temple-of-the-holy-spirit > stuff may be entertaining philosophy, but it won't get you to > first base. Not lusty enough. Think bawdy. Another thing that I disagree with is this attitude of people that you should have "experience". If you don't want "experience" but rather to be with some- one who you really care for, would have/be the father of their baby, would stand behind them, etc., doesn't mean you're strange, just that you want some- thing else out of a relationship outside of sexual gratification. (I'm not saying sexual gratification is bad either, *if that's what you want*, then go for it, but don't belittle the people who don't want it, because their reasons are just as good for not wanting it as yours for wanting it.) > Most people I know had their first sexual experiences in their teens, > when everything in the world is exciting and confusing (ah, those > hormones, like a sugar maple on a warm day in March!) and memories > of embarrassing bumbling are quickly forgotten in a jumble of new > experiences and you don't know who you are from one day to the next > anyway. It must be a real nightmare for an adult with a bad self- > image and a good memory. I feel for you, Jeff. As an aside, dunno where you came from, but in NYC where I grew up, it was still down in the thirties in March :-) About the only thing that I agree with in the previous paragraph is that life is exciting and confusing when you're a teenager (however, I'm 23 and life is still confusing, if not exciting :-). I don't want to speak for Jeff, but (I'm going to anyway) it seems to me that he would benefit from a loving and caring SO (wife maybe?). You're right in that he can't expect his SO to heal him, but perhaps they can fill the gaps in each other's lives. -- Hug me till you drug me, honey! Greg Skinner (gregbo) {allegra,cbosgd,ihnp4}!hou2e!gregbo