Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/17/84; site plus5.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!mhuxr!ihnp4!plus5!hokey From: hokey@plus5.UUCP (Hokey) Newsgroups: net.mail Subject: Re: name change Message-ID: <607@plus5.UUCP> Date: Fri, 22-Feb-85 16:23:13 EST Article-I.D.: plus5.607 Posted: Fri Feb 22 16:23:13 1985 Date-Received: Tue, 26-Feb-85 07:40:26 EST References: <484@digi-g.UUCP> <405@lsuc.UUCP> <597@plus5.UUCP> <603@plus5.UUCP> <604@plus5.UUCP> <890@cbosgd.UUCP> Reply-To: hokey@plus5.UUCP (Hokey) Organization: Plus Five Computer Services, St. Louis Lines: 106 Summary: Is the conversational followup technique good or bad? In article <890@cbosgd.UUCP> mark@cbosgd.UUCP (Mark Horton) writes: >Well, I guess the rest of this discussion now has to be done in public. >If the reader is bored, feel free to turn it off or skip ahead. People would be bored if they didn't care, or were burned out, or felt we were discussing really stupid things. If they don't care, they probably aren't reading this newsgroup. If they are burned out, I can understand it, but I would appreciate it if they would rekindle enough to get the application fully designed and documented. If this is a stupid discussion, they can always ignore it or flame me (or anybody else...). >Hokey - I don't see the connection between enhancing netnews >and maintaining a huge flat domain space. We already have permanent >postings - namely articles with expiration dates in the future. Expiration dates in the future won't work for reasons I mentioned in another article. Basically, lots of people run "find" scripts which delete old articles because expire lets things fall through the cracks, disk systems fill up and the history file gets truncated, and several other fun things. Furthermore, new sites won't get any of the existing articles. >What we don't have is a way to >keep the same article number on different versions, or to automatically >expire the previous version when a new version comes in. These features >only matter when you want humans to read the article using standard >netnews interfaces, and this doesn't make sense for a map. Again, not quite sufficient. What about new sites? The extensions noted would be *useful* (although perhaps not necessary) for map maintenance, but would be of *great* help for net-etiquette and other documents, including RFCs, oft-posted sources or manual pages, and "Standards" documents (like design documents for mail and news software). I'm interested in generalizing the software, so we can avoid problems like this in the future. >What I don't see is how this solves the problem of a huge flat name space. >Who has responsibility for the database? Who resolves name conflicts? The Domain Registrar, and the regional registrars/administrators, just like they do now. >Who has the master copy? Where >do you go if you want an accurate copy to send someone in another domain? Anybody who keeps the postings on line. I realize that the sent copy would be accurate to the moment it was retrieved, similar to the way a balance sheet reflects the books at a point in time. How accurate should the registrars be? >How do you prevent site B from changing site A's data against site A's wishes? We're talking moderated postings of public data. If A wants secure data, A can maintain a separate database using the mechanism you mentioned earlier, and manually post changes (similar to rmgroup control messages). >What are hosts that don't get netnews supposed to do? They can either run the netnews software and only receive the appropriate postings, or wait until some Angel writes the software, or let some other site be their smartmailer, or ... >That don't have the disk space to store such a huge database? >That don't want to have UNIX directories with thousands of files in them? Parts of the previous answer apply here. Again, if there is going to be any significant traffic between two sites, they should connect. This will tend to reduce the amount of tables needed at "minimal" routing sites. >What do you do about situations where the entire 2nd >level must be published somewhere - it will be huge! What cases are these? So what if it is huge? It is big because there are a lot of sites! >How do new sites come on-line? They contact the Domain Registrar, who initially verifies that the name is not already in use, and probably turfs the request over to a regional registrar for ongoing maintenance of connectivity information. The "assistant" registrar/administrator is the one who posts updates to the moderated map group. >What if a machine doesn't run UNIX so it can't get news? Then what are they doing in the UUCP domain, and how are they running this mail system? Otherwise, the news software seems to be a superset of RFC822, and that is what mail will probably look like, so them find a way to get the map postings (if they want them; see earlier answers about "lack of space", "we don't run netnews", and a couple of others). > Mark Hokey PS - catch the next posting for Answers to Questions Not Yet Asked! -- Hokey ..ihnp4!plus5!hokey 314-725-9492