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From: teitz@aecom.UUCP (Eliyahu Teitz)
Newsgroups: net.religion.jewish
Subject: Re: Re: Schechter's Answer to Abeles: A Question
Message-ID: <1152@aecom.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 13-Feb-85 13:39:56 EST
Article-I.D.: aecom.1152
Posted: Wed Feb 13 13:39:56 1985
Date-Received: Sun, 17-Feb-85 04:52:09 EST
References: <224@lcuxc.UUCP>
Organization: Albert Einstein Coll. of Med., NY
Lines: 45


     quote at end.


    Two points. Firstly, the reason the Niturei Karta are opposed to the
 state is their interpretation of halacha that no organized state would
 be started in Israel without Mashiach, and that any attempt should there-
 fore be rejected ( the last phrase is their addition ). They should have
 in theory opposed a state of religious Jews too ( although if they were 
 offered control of the country I don't know how vehemently they would
 have objected ).

    My second point is about your question. Rav Kook, first Chief Rabbi
 of Israel, was once asked why there were so many irreligious people in
 Israel. He told te questioner of a place he ha visited in America where
 many sick people ( physically ill ) used to go to a hot spring for bathing
 purposes. The questioner replied that it was Saratoga Springs ( as I 
 recall the story, I might be wrong ). Rav Kook asked the man if it bothered
 him that so many sick people came to such a beautiful place. The man
 responded Of course not. They are coming to be cured. So too said Rav Kook
 the non religious in Israel are coming to a spiritual hot spring, and the
 hope is that even though they do not realize it, they will become 
 spiritually more healthy by just living in Israel.
    Now to answer your question. Maybe G-D set Israel up inte hands of
 the non religious to make it more accomodating for them, so that more of
 them would come to Israel and get a dose of spirituality. If the religious
 had a strangle hold on the country from its inception, many non religious
 people would have stayed far away. This doesn't mean that the country 
 should be totally irreligious, but it should also not make the irreligious
 feel out of place.

				Eliyahu Teitz.


> I had always understood that one of the reasons the so-called
> "ultra-Orthodox" Hasidic sects such as the Satmars and their 
> followers in Israel, the Naturei Karta, are opposed to the State of
> Israel is because they view it as founded by irreligious MEN, not
> by God according to His Torah.  If indeed the present-day State of
> Israel was founded by God, and is in fact a lineal continuation of
> the state and land promised to Abraham, then WHY were God's 
> instruments in the "rebirth" (Schecter's word) a series of far from
> devout men: Moses Hess, Thedore Herzl, Vladimir Jabotinsky, Chaim
> Weitzmann, David Ben-Gurion, et. al.?  
> --