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From: mn@dscvax2.UUCP (Matt Noah)
Newsgroups: net.abortion
Subject: Mikki Barry is a Pro-Lifer
Message-ID: <233@dscvax2.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 12-Mar-85 18:11:13 EST
Article-I.D.: dscvax2.233
Posted: Tue Mar 12 18:11:13 1985
Date-Received: Sat, 16-Mar-85 01:44:20 EST
Organization: Digital Sound Corp., Santa Barbara
Lines: 64

> One thing you will have to contend with on this newsgroup are assumptions
> made by pro-life:
>		1.  The woman must be "responsible" for her naughty action
>		    of having sex.  The "punishment", have the baby.  Note,
>		    that even though the "famous" rape/incest victim is 
>		    allowed to have the abortion because it isn't her fault
>                   she is pregnant.
>		2.  The want for the fetus to be carried to term overides any
>		    wants of the mother.
Interesting that you view pro-lifers this way.  I am surprised that one who
follows the argument could have such an attitude.  Do you really think that
people who are pro-life view sex as "naughty"?  It would appear that you 
want to make pro-lifers appear child-like in their moral beliefs.  I think
what you might want to say is that their is a portion of the pro-life
community who view sex as something special and as an act which bears
certain responsibilities.  If that's what you mean, I think I could agree
with you.  Also, I don't think you meant to say that only the woman is
responsible so nearly all of us presumably uneducated pro-lifers now
realize that males have something to do with bringing about pregnancy.
Your second assumption is cleverly worded, also.  Rhetorically, who speaks
for the views of the pregnant woman?  The woman, of course.  Well now,
again rhetorically, who speaks for the unborn child?  I guess you understand
my point.  If not, let me emphasize it: someone has to speak for the rights
of unborn children!  Unlike the pro-abortionist, however, the pro-life
community has extended itself to care for the needs of the mother; providing
counseling, housing, food and love.  We don't make any $$ doing it, either.

> In case you haven't realized by now, I am pro abortion on demand (so are 76%
> of Boston's catholics by the way).  However, I also believe that there are
> many women who wouldn't have abortions if there was adequate birth control
> information available, AND if pro-lifers and pro-choicers could work together
> WITHOUT trying to convince the pregnant woman whether or not to have an 
> abortion, and just lay out ALL the options.  I know that many clinics do not
> have access to information concerning group homes and financial aid, and
> adoption assistance available to pregnant women.  And I know that many pro-
> life groups do not have the medical information necessary to make an informed
> decision as to whether or not to have an abortion.

76% of Boston's Catholics are not pro-abortion.  Please get your facts straight
before posting such a fallacy.  Adequate birth control information is 
availabel to any person who is responsible enough to seek it.   Similarly,
adequate information is available to any responsible individual about
abortion and its alternatives.  You are naive to think that pro-lifers will
work together with pro-choicers to provide every alternative to abortion.
Each has their selfish interest to protect ($ for pro-choicers, LIFE for
pro-lifers) and will not work with the other.  As for the rest of the
above paragraph; where do you come by your "knowledge"?  We in Santa Barbara
have all the necessary medical information, counselors and help one could
ask for.  This is so typical of pro-life groups that what you say is just
an out-n-out lie!

> Abortions have been done for thousands of years.  There will always be those 
> women who will have them.  Wouldn't it be better to lose only one life
> than two?  And better still to provide the education to prevent the
> pregnancy in the first place?
>
> Mikki Barry

Mikki, I think you just became a pro-lifer.  If you read your last paragraph
you will notice that you admit that a life is lost during an abortion.  You
may think that you just slipped but I think you've admitted that life begins
before birth!  Congratulations!

Matt Noah