Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP
Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site gargoyle.UChicago.UUCP
Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!mhuxr!ihnp4!crsp!gargoyle!scott
From: scott@gargoyle.UChicago.UUCP (Scott Deerwester)
Newsgroups: net.religion,net.religion.christian
Subject: Re: what does it mean to talk to God [a brief attempt at an answer]
Message-ID: <366@gargoyle.UChicago.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 12-Mar-85 11:15:41 EST
Article-I.D.: gargoyle.366
Posted: Tue Mar 12 11:15:41 1985
Date-Received: Wed, 13-Mar-85 01:08:46 EST
References: <893@topaz.ARPA> <2635@mcnc.UUCP> <>
Reply-To: scott@gargoyle.UUCP ( Deerwester)
Organization: U. Chicago - Computer Science
Lines: 39
Keywords: Personal experience
Xref: watmath net.religion:5969 net.religion.christian:415
Summary: 

A cute satire, but there's an important flaw here exists in a lot of
what you and others say about the role of personal experience.  I've
read a few dozen articles, the gist of which is, "what makes your
experience any more valid that the experiences of {Rich Rosen,
Buddhists, Ubizmologists, ...}?"  The difference is that mine aren't
made-up examples.  I'd be glad to discuss the subjective basis as
well as the objective basis for my faith with you.  It's just that
statements describing a hypothetical personal experience that most
people (including me) would agree is off the wall doesn't send me
into a cold chill, doubting everything that I've ever experienced.

All that you're doing is saying, "See, I can make up an example of a
personal experience that clearly has no relationship to reality.
Therefore no personal experiences, including yours, can be used as
the basis for anything."  Sorry, but I'm not convinced.

Another important point: the subjective basis complements the
objective basis.  There are a lot of reasons why I believe that Jesus
Christ is really the Son of God, and that He really did die for my
sins.  Some are based on personal experience.  A lot of others
aren't.  Some that aren't:

	- the resurrection (see "Who Moved The Stone?")
	- fulfilled prophesies in the life of Jesus
	- the testimony and lives of people who were with Him
	- His words and wisdom (C.S. Lewis' "Lord, lunatic or liar" argument)
	- the Earth (the creation implies creator argument)

When I add everything up, including my own experiences and a rational
look at objective evidence, believing in God makes a lot more sense
than anything else that I've heard.
-- 
	Scott Deerwester
	Graduate Library School
	University of Chicago

...!ihnp4!gargoyle!scott	UUCP
scott@UChicago.CSNet		CSNet
scott@UChicago.ARPA		ARPA