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From: merrill@raja.DEC (Rick)
Newsgroups: net.religion
Subject: How much is that free will in the window?
Message-ID: <1216@decwrl.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 21-Mar-85 08:48:52 EST
Article-I.D.: decwrl.1216
Posted: Thu Mar 21 08:48:52 1985
Date-Received: Sat, 23-Mar-85 00:31:31 EST
Sender: daemon@decwrl.UUCP
Organization: DEC Engineering Network
Lines: 36

Me: How then do you tell the difference between your will and the various 
    influences impressed upon you?

Thee: One's "will" *IS* the various influences impressed upon one, is it not?

Your statement comes from
an attempt to feel that "everything is under control" called Determinism.
Determinism is itself an outgrowth of Jeudeo-Christian belief that God has
ordered the universe (and life) into a coherent and possibly understandable
whole - i.e. causality per se with God as the prime cause followed by a
succession of cause and effects.

A will is NOT deterministic, however, and is the sole exception to the ordered
universe concept.

From a scientific point of view the will is NOT the sum of various influences
simply because the brain, the personality, the psyche, the ego, the WILL
is/are so complex that randomness of any kind entering the system can come to
dominate the result.  Catastrophy Theory 
(an outgrowth of Topology Theory) epitomizes this type of
phenomemon.  For weather forcasting this could mean that "the beat of a 
butterfly's wings in Brazil can affect the weather in New England".

NOW will you answer my question, using any frame of reference you like:
How Do You Tell The Difference Between Your Will And That Of Someone Else?


Someone else: (but it sounds like Thee!)
>>`Free will' is one of my favorite subjects, but most people
>>don't take me seriously.  Yes, I believe that there is no free will.
Me:
> We have willed not to take you seriously, therefore we have a will that
> is demonstrably free from yours!   :-)

Posted:	Thu 21-Mar-1985 08:45 (Maynard_Time)
To:	NET$PHILOSOPHY, NET$RELIGION