Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site udenva.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!philabs!cmcl2!seismo!hao!nbires!boulder!cisden!udenva!ttorgers From: ttorgers@udenva.UUCP (Troy Torgerson) Newsgroups: net.games.frp Subject: Re: limiting magic (A solution?) Message-ID: <500@udenva.UUCP> Date: Sun, 7-Apr-85 23:02:32 EST Article-I.D.: udenva.500 Posted: Sun Apr 7 23:02:32 1985 Date-Received: Tue, 9-Apr-85 03:52:29 EST References: <> Reply-To: ttorgers@udenva.UUCP (Troy Torgerson) Distribution: net Organization: U of Denver Lines: 111 In article <> baldwin@cornell.UUCP (Michael S. Baldwin) writes: >yeah, well, whatever > >I prefer the idea of expensive material components being required to create >lasting magic. After all, what were all those spells written with? and on? >For instance, inscribing a rune for a fire spell, better have a little >ground ruby and dragon blood, etc. This solution make seem artificial, >but consider that a spell is a piece of power contained and focused by the >mage's will, if he continues to concentrate on the spell, no problem, but >if he ignores it entropy sets in and the spell decays until there's nothing >left. The rationale for material components of this nature is to say that >they have sufficient power to hold the spell in statis until it is invoked, >which negates the need for continous concentration. Another alternative >along this line is to limit the total number of items on the rationale that >some part of your will must continue to concentrate on all magic that you >have created to maintain its existance, if you make too much, you forget >about that one wand, and POOF, gone. The problem here, of course, is >death, what happens to all your magic if you die, and ergo cease to will >its continued existance, and what about enemy mages and their items? >Perhaps the loss of the mage causes only a slow decay that can be reversed >if caught in time. > >hmm.... I agree with the spell components part, but the concentration gets too messy to deal with. . I think that perhaps extending the material components idea a bit would be better. Ok, to take the example from above, a ruby and dragon's blood. These are nice things to need to cast a spell. Where do the PC's get this stuff from? Sure they could go down to the nearest MU shop and MAYBE get some Dragon blood. . . How much does Dragon blood cost? How much is available? WHAT kind of dragon blood? Even in a very large city, there won't be that much Dragon blood. . . Since killing a Dragon contains some considerable risk (& travel expenses!) the price for a very small vial of the stuff should be rather high. If the Dragon blood has to be fairly fresh, a lot would be a waste to keep around, so the local shop shouldn't carry much and if the PC's managed to get large quanties of the stuff, then it should spoil before they use much of it! The results of using spoiled dragons blood could cause the spell to blow up or backfire(going off right then) or cause the spell to backfire at a later date, or . . . All of which would, of course, destroy the ruby and maybe whatever the spell was cast on(or who) etc... Lot's of possiblities here for the creative DM! Ok, now for what kind of Dragon blood. . . Let's say the PC's are in a town or city that leans towards the good alignments. Now, if they need evil Dragon's blood, then nobody would mind, BUT if they needed the Blood from a GOOD Dragon, (which is of course outlawed there!) they would have to *try* to deal with the thieves guild, most likely from another town, to get some (which would of course cost double or triple the normal price, which is already high. . .) OR, better yet, the PC's might not be able to convince anyone else to get them some Dragon blood, so they have to go out and find one (of the right color!) by themselves! Enough about Dragon blood, since everyone can see where that goes. . :-) Now, about the ruby. . How much do you need EACH time the PC casts the spell? What value? If the ruby was only 100gp value, then make the spell need at least 10 or so.. or something along those lines. . . Maybe a 5000 or 10000 gp ruby might be needed if the spell is powerful enough. . . Of course, there is the tricky problem of getting hundreds of the rubies (No matter what their cost) in a town that has maybe one or two jewelry shops. I'm sure you can't just walk into a place and buy a hundred 100gp rubies all in one shot! Say the PC's *try* to get *even* with the DM by "ordering" those rubies from a shop to be delivered later. . . Well, the shop could take the order on the condition that the PC's put up the money for them in advance (anywhere from 70-100%) and then tell the PC's that it will take at LEAST a week. . . And of course, there just happened to be a thief from the thieve's guild from somewhere who heard this deal going on, and plots to waylay them on the way to the city or comes in to the shop when the gems arrive, polymorphed as one of the PC's who ordered the gems in the first place! What happens if the shopkeeper passes off the rubies as 100gp when they are really 50 or 75 gp. . . This would really screw up a spell! Lot's of possibilities here too! Of course, once this has happened, the PC's might want to hire an escort for the gems (or the shopkeeper, who would charge for that too!) which would cost a lot of money (especially if they wanted honest ones!) Now for the most important part! WHERE are the PC's going to get all the money to BUY all these things? Sitting around and spending money for year really depletes the money bags! Unless you run a MH campaign, which I'm sure you don't or this whole thing wouldn't have bothered you in the first place, The PC's will have to go find work or earn money in some other way to pay for all this! All this should limit the number of things that they can create because of the shear factor of the time involved. . . Of course, if the PC's WANT to do that, then I have already given a very small example of the possibilities for adventures that would be a lot of fun for both the player and the DM! After all, if they had to go through several adventures just to get the ingredients for something, then they would really appreciate that item (be it scroll or whatever) and they wouldn't waste it (scroll etc..) either! Sure, if they show signs of only wanting to create something on a rare basis, you don't have to make it so hard to get the things that they need, but if they want to abuse the system, then you can too! Wow, sorry to get so long, but my fingers and my brain finally got coordinated! Troy seismo!hao!udenva!ttorgers