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From: ellen@reed.UUCP (Ellen)
Newsgroups: net.religion
Subject: Re: Identity
Message-ID: <1167@reed.UUCP>
Date: Mon, 25-Mar-85 15:47:37 EST
Article-I.D.: reed.1167
Posted: Mon Mar 25 15:47:37 1985
Date-Received: Tue, 2-Apr-85 20:20:44 EST
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Organization: Reed College, Portland, Oregon
Lines: 67

> 	4.  Christians are the direct descendants of the thirteen tribes of
> 	Jacob, whose name God changed to Israel.

Since when are Christians and not Jews the direct descendants of
Jews?  I am most confused. 

> 	Regarding the Jews, we believe:
> 
> 	1.  They are the descendants of Esau, the Edomite, who sold his
> 	birthright for a bowl of beans.  (Read scripture to find out
> 	the exploits of Esau.)  These people eventually became known as
> 	the Canaanites, amongst others.  Esau was very prolific.

This is another weird genealogical twist, Donnie boy.  Where did
you get this one?  (It ain't in scripture, I'm certain).

> 
> 	2.  At the time of Christ, these people were known as the Scribes
> 	and Pharisees.  Christ had absolutely nothing good to say about them.
> 	In fact, He even identified them directly as the sons of Satan 
> 	(in John 8 as I recall).  

It's certainly true that Christ and the Pharisees didn't get
along in scripture.  But, again, where do you get the notion
that  the modern Jews are descendants of the Pharisees who are
descendants of Esau???

> 
> 	4.  Modern Jews are the descendents of the Pharisees, who Christ
> 	condemned.  (Don't quote me, but I believe there is an explicit
> 	reference to this in the Jewish Encyclopedia of 1925, in which
> 	the Jewish author actually admits this.  I personnally don't 
> 	like to cite something unless I have a hard copy in my hands.)
 
More of the same.

> 
> 	5.  The modern Jews, therefore, have no claim to being "Israelites."
> 	7.  It would appear that the Talmud probably has its roots in the
> 	religious traditions of ancient pagan Babylon.  Remember that the
> 	Israelites were in captivity in Babylon for a period of time, and
> 	many Israelites adopted the religion and practices of Babylon.
> 	Christ also condemned the "ancient traditions of men" that were
> 	practiced by the Pharisees.

Uh...somebody Jewish correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't most of
the Talmud written considerably before the Israelites went to
Babylon?  And Christ's condemnation of the "ancient traditions
of men" is pretty general for you to stick that on
Babylonian/?Phariseean practices.

> 	     Do you see why the Jews hate Identity Christians with a purple
> 	passion?  This is straight out of scripture, and the dispersion of 
> 	the Lost Tribes and their migration to western Europe is backed up
> 	by archeology, history, and tradition.

I'd sure like to see some reputable archeological/historical
background for this.  Note I said "reputable".

Incidentally, Don, in a previous posting you flamed somebody
(Rich, I believe) for using obscenity where there are ladies
present.

Fuck you.

Love, Ellen