Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 (Denver Mods 7/26/84) 6/24/83; site drutx.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!mhuxr!mhuxt!houxm!ahuta!drutx!slb From: slb@drutx.UUCP (Sue Brezden) Newsgroups: net.games.frp Subject: RE: How do YOU fleece PCs? Message-ID: <2553@drutx.UUCP> Date: Sat, 20-Apr-85 19:04:36 EST Article-I.D.: drutx.2553 Posted: Sat Apr 20 19:04:36 1985 Date-Received: Sun, 21-Apr-85 04:41:03 EST Organization: AT&T Information Systems Laboratories, Denver Lines: 179 I received many good mail items in response to my previous posting. Thought I'd share them with the net. _____________________________________________________________________ Fleecing PC's eh? Well, years ago, in one campaign, our DM made the mistake of allowing us to get several nasty magic items. For example, a Rod of Lordly Might ! and a Robe of Scantillating Colours (did i spell that write ?) At any rate, things got a little out of hand. Our character with the RoLM didn't know how to use it, and kept screwing up. The RoSC became an awesome weapon, save or be stunned, so we'd turn it on, and start moving through the dungeon, killing as we went. This was not good. So the DM made a change. The Rod of Lordly Might became the Rod of Lardly Might, able to shoot oil (flaming) at creatures. For extra charges, it could work as a flame thrower. But it removed all the problems of dealing with a RoLM. The Robe became a Robe of Scantillating Curves, enabling the wearer to appear as a Dryad. Again, useful, but effective in reducing the Magic of the Character. I also seem to remember my Robe of Useful Items becoming a Robe of Useless Items (a dead rat instead of a door !?!). This method worked, with little dissention because we all knew that we had too much magic, and the game was getting out of hand. Perhaps you can place them up against a powerful MU, who casts a spell, then runs. This spell would change the items. Jim Sullivan --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sue, The problem in our campaign is not Magic-Users, but Thieves. Perhaps I shouldn't call them Thieves, byt Syndics. Mages spend so much time in research and what not that they don't have time to raise money, and we have kept enchanting prices very high. Anyway, the solution to the problem is a very sophisticated version of the stagecoach robbery. One or two top-flight (13th + levels) thieves organize a group of advancible npc's to hit the party and help steal their items. The attacking group will need to be well-balanced in terms of character classses, with plenty of healing magic around, and plenty of other magic. We have found that a group with surprise, and prepared spells can do wonders! Remember though, that you don't want to fireball the items to pieces and that the thieves aren't trying to kill the party-members, although this can happen accidentally. As we play Greyhawk-style D&D the attackers would be HASTED, some would be INVISIBLE (probably the top thieves, to let them get the backstab multiplier) and SILENCE spells would be laid down on top of the parties spell-casters. Anyway, that's the brute forece method. A more fun method perhaps, is to persuade the players to give up their items. We call this con artistry. ~r .trailer ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- A DM I played for a few years ago pulled a nasty trick on us. We managed to get teleported from the surface into an underground cavern, minus all possessions -- all we had left were our skivvies. After creating some makeshift weapons out of sticks, we managed to survive and return to the surface, where we found all of our possesions except for our magic items. My fighter lost two very nice magic weapons, never to be found again. As a player, it wasn't much fun. One possibility would be some sort of magic-destroying trap. Any magic items taken into this trap (perhaps a room or corridor) are affected in some way: they disintegrate, they lose some or all of their magic, they reverse their magic (+2 sword becomes -2, etc.), of course without the player's knowledge until the next time they try to use it. Maybe each PC has to make a saving throw for each magic item they are carrying. They should be given some chance of recognizing the trap as a potentially nasty trap, rather than having them blindly stumble into it and lose their magic, and innovative PCs should be able to figure out some way to dispel it (but not too easy :-) A brutal way would be to kill all the PCs, forcing everyone to roll up new ones (I did this once, accidentally, while GMing RuneQuest). Since everyone dies, nobody survives to recover the magic. The next group of PCs perhaps could go on a quest to recover the missing bodies and magic items. Or have the PCs captured somehow, and the captor demands one magic item per head before they may be released. Alan Bland, druxp!mab ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Well in my dungeon I have a very simple scheme: I give each player an additional number known as thier "church rateing" (a number which is based on their donations to the local church, and which exibits exponential growth and diminishing returns). This rateing effects how much they must pay for church services (like having them do a resurection). To get and maintain a rateing of about 20 costs about 30% of all treasure found (at 20 they can get resurections at a cost measured in 100's not 1000's or more). They need a rateing of about 70-80 to get everything free (though there is a limit due to the limited staff at the church). The church remembers all, and a failure to give a suitable donation has a negative effect for some time. A negative rateing (of course) increases the costs exponentially. This method has kept my players poor for over 10 years (real time). Another method I've seen is to only give experience for SPENDING money, not finding it. Usually a player has to specify a catagory (or several) for which such spending will count (e.g. "wine, women, and song"). Any money spent on other things don't gain experience, nor does money not spent at all. Hope this helps. Ray ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > When do you know that PCs have too many goodies? When they are finding things easy. When they are faced with a puzzle, they should have to think about it; the outcome of a combat should be sufficiantly unpredictable that they worry or become tense. "sufficiently" is a little tricky here. The important things are: 1) be fair. Give the NPCs an even break too. Let THEM go up levels... 2) be consistent. Nothing is worse than having to go back on your word (so be vague now and again! Use phrases like "you see what appears to be a..." "it looks like...", and "as far as you can tell..".) 3) watch out for bored players. Combat can help occasionally (once per four or five sessions, perhaps, before someone says "look out, don't yawn or we'll get an encounter!" :-) ), as can "you notice a..." or "you meet a.. who only speaks ..., or who used to live at...or ... 4) yes, USE NPCs. There should always be a few floating around. One or two might have to go with them for some PLAUSIBLE reason, so that advice & the odd bit of high power magic might be available. 5) I prefer to start out PCs at 1st level. No magic items. By the time they get to 3rd level, maybe a magic (+1) sword/dagger or two. But if a player joins in late, a robe of useful items or something similar can leave the other players wondering what soert of fellow is this new PC? (and they won't trust him...) >What is your favorite way of separating PCs from their funds--the nastier >and more devious the better, of course. 1) don't give them much (easier said than done.. may be too late).. hand out silver coins instead of gold... 2) there's a TAX on entering the town/crossing the tollbridge 3) that NPC is an 8th level thief... 4) where are they carrying it? It's quite heavy. There are no free banks, they charge. Bury it & get it dug up (10%/month in a town?)... 5) inflation - if they've been in 1 place for a while, prices rise.. 6) the Inland Revenue Inspector has a briefcase of devouring [:-):-)] 7) [topical...] buying material components/magic sword/rings... note that the items have a chance of failing. no? Give them one! (and DON'T tell the players what it is!!!!!) Finally, NEVER fleece players. The NPCs might, but YOU DON'T!!! if you do, your players might well start looking for another DM.... All the best.. If there's anything else, you only have to ask... - Russell ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks to all who responded. I would try to thank you personally--and still may, but some large hairy monster has been scaring my mail back to me from various paths. -- Sue Brezden Real World: Room 1B17 Net World: ihnp4!drutx!slb AT&T Information Systems 11900 North Pecos Westminster, Co. 80234 (303)538-3829 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Honk if you love Shiva! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~