Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site boulder.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!bonnie!akgua!sdcsvax!dcdwest!ittvax!decvax!genrad!panda!talcott!harvard!seismo!hao!nbires!boulder!geoff From: geoff@boulder.UUCP (Geoffrey M. Clemm) Newsgroups: net.philosophy Subject: Re: Self Imprisonment Message-ID: <341@boulder.UUCP> Date: Thu, 11-Apr-85 12:06:24 EST Article-I.D.: boulder.341 Posted: Thu Apr 11 12:06:24 1985 Date-Received: Sun, 14-Apr-85 03:29:59 EST References: <362@aesat.UUCP> <5272@utzoo.UUCP> <137@ubvax.UUCP> <5343@utzoo.UUCP> Reply-To: geoff@boulder.UUCP (Geoffrey Clemm) Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder Lines: 25 In article ellis@spar.UUCP (Michael Ellis) writes: > Laura, I cannot believe a person as otherwise well-read as you > seem to be still believes that the world is deterministic ... > > This comment is equally directed at Rich Rosen. > note that: > THERE IS NOTHING DETERMINISTIC IN THIS UNIVERSE > Check out any text in quantum mechanics. > Your insistence on imagining that everything is inevitable in > spite the enormous weight of scientific evidence that would > indicate otherwise strikes me as almost Sargentian self-torture. Michael, everyone is aware of the existence of randomness. Unfortunately randomness is not useful for analyzing the concept of free will that interests many of us (i.e. where it is the determiner of responsibility/blame). If someone was discussing the difficulty getting to Finland, your response is analagous to saying "but you're forgetting that you could just rent a car !!". We're all aware that you can rent a car, but unfortunately, the problem being discussed centered around how to cross the Atlantic, for which the possession of a car is irrelevant. > At the risk of boring this newsgroup by repeating myself ... Yes.