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From: london@oddjob.UUCP (David London)
Newsgroups: net.flame
Subject: The shame of alice!jj
Message-ID: <701@oddjob.UUCP>
Date: Sat, 27-Apr-85 14:36:38 EDT
Article-I.D.: oddjob.701
Posted: Sat Apr 27 14:36:38 1985
Date-Received: Sun, 28-Apr-85 08:44:00 EDT
Distribution: net
Organization: U. Chicago, Astronomy & Astrophysics
Lines: 53

<>
alice!jj says

> Those who suffered by Hitler's Germany DO have a legitimate
> reason to not want the lives of their tormentors/murderers/etc
> glorified.  HOWEVER, I do NOT see ANYONE glorifying these people,
> Ronald Reagan included.  A visit to a cemetary simply does NOT
> imply approval at all.  It DOES acknowledge the tragedy, which very 
> well may have a positive effect if it prevents future like tragedies.

Aside: For those of you new to net.flame, since it is in one's intellectual
best interests to know about the person from whom one gets one's information,
I will summarize my impressions of alice!jj. alice!jj is a person who 
characterizes himself neither as a democrat or a republican; neither 
liberal (which he considers a *dirty* word) nor a conservative (though
he leans towards this side, as you can probably guess from the above 
article); rather he fancies himself as a "thinking" man (by the way, 
I assume that he is male - I doubt a woman would refer to Geraldine 
Ferraro as "The Beaver"), one who looks at both sides of an issue before
deciding what his position is. <-- Note: dripping sarcasm. End aside.

Obviously alice!jj, at his sensitive and sympathetic best, has
understood this issue inside and out, otherwise we would not have the
benefit of his wisdom on the net. Nevertheless, I feel he may have
missed a point or two (which, truth to tell, are obvious to all but the
most moronic of people (of which Reagan appears to be one)).

Simply put: a visit to a cemetary honours those buried therein. The SS
did *nothing* to merit any honour whatsoever. Nobody is trying to forget
the SS and the Nazis; in fact it is the Jewish tradition to remember.
The Jewish people simply want the SS remembered for what they were.
Why do you think that a visit to a concentration camp was requested by
the Jewish populace?

> Please note that if the President were to refer to the
> SS soldiers as "wonderful, glorious human beings, etc etc" or something
> like that, I <and many others, I'm bloody well sure> would be
> thoroughly offended.  If the president refers to "those
> tragic souls" or something like that, I can't see how that's offensive
> at all.

Somehow I think that alice!jj really believes this. Subtlety is somehow
lost on him (which is a dreadful handicap if one considers oneself a
"thinking" person). Let's see if we can broaden his mind somewhat.
"Tragic souls" are people whom you might feel sorry for; people who you
might be sorry are dead (if they are); people for whom you feel some
positive emotion. Even though you (alice!jj) apparently don't hear this 
when you hear the phrase "tragic souls", lots of people do. Oh well, I
guess one of alice!jj's shortcomings is that he has to be hit over the
head by a brick before he feels anything. He obviously doesn't understand
connotations in words and symbolism in actions. What an idiot.

				..!ihnp4!oddjob!london