Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site ptsfa.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!philabs!cmcl2!seismo!umcp-cs!gymble!lll-crg!dual!ptsfa!rob From: rob@ptsfa.UUCP (Rob Bernardo) Newsgroups: net.motss Subject: Re: Alcohol and It's Effect on Relationships Message-ID: <605@ptsfa.UUCP> Date: Wed, 1-May-85 11:52:59 EDT Article-I.D.: ptsfa.605 Posted: Wed May 1 11:52:59 1985 Date-Received: Sat, 4-May-85 04:11:01 EDT References: <1923@decwrl.UUCP> Reply-To: rob@ptsfa.UUCP (Rob Bernardo) Distribution: net Organization: Pacific Bell, San Francisco Lines: 72 Keywords: gay, alcholism, ghetto, individuality, identity Summary: The effects of gay-ghettoization In article <1923@decwrl.UUCP> levasseur@morgan.DEC (Edge of the Razor) writes: > > I've been having quite a few conversations with gay men and women lately >about how alcohol effects their relationships. ... > ... most claiming that the >relationshiop went well until alcohol came into the picture. ... > I had a conversation with a friend over concerns on his part that the only >gay outlets seem to revolve around booze. ... >There are the obvious bars where people drink to get up the courage to talk >to someone, brunch with its bloody Mary's and Mamosas, dinner parties with >the obligatory cocktail table, resorts like P'Town where drinking seems to >follow most activities, etc. I realize that you "don't have to accept" the >offered cocktail but it is very visable in most gay social activities. Don't >get me wrong, I enjoy having a couple of drinks in pleasant relaxed company, >but there an awful lot of people who cannot. I sometimes womder if our comm- >unity's problems with alcohol (much higher than our straight brethren) stems >from the availability of alcohol or is it due to the higher emotional burdens >that gay men and women face from society; a way to kill the subconscious pain >of existing in a hostile environment. One major factor is the gay ghetto. In most places in this country due to homophobia at large there is virtually no integration of gay sociability in the mainstream. Gay men are "forced" to socialize in particular limited settings (especially gay bars) in order to socialize with each other. However, in places like San Francisco, where gay sociability is probably more integrated into the mainstream than anywhere else in the country, gay ghetto behavior still persists, which is a shame because I think the ghetto (in either case) has some real bad effects. Basically the members of the ghetto often become too in-bred and a lot of people get sucked up into certain behaviors to fit in. Go down to Castro Street on a beautiful Saturday and look at the hordes of gay men nevertheless crowded into a dark, smokey bar. Go into even one of the nicer gay restaurants for dinner, and listen to LOUD disco/rock/etc. music while you eat. I think that in coming out and coming to San Francisco and trying to get one's freedom, a lot of gay men lose sense of their own individuality, THEIR OWN IDENTITY, which is incredibly ironic. The larger cities do offer gay men alternatives to the bars, e.g. square dance groups, sporting activities, but unfortunately a lot of the ghetto mentality is often brought into these socializing spots as well. In recent years I have begun to leave behind some of my ghetto identity and develop my own, after being out for 14 years, and living in the SF area for 11. I remember this one moment when I had the realization "I am becoming Rob!" In certain ways it has been frustrating for me. A lot of the ways I like to spend my free time are not popular with very many gay men I meet here in the city and a lot of the more common ways that gay men here socialize don't interest me. There is one bar here that a lot of my friends and I go to. None of us (nor quite a number of the other patrons I've spoken to in this bar) go to any other bars at all -- no interest in that. This bar is a gay country/western dance bar and a lot of the guys who go there really like (partner) dancing with each other. There is much less drinking than in other bars to the point that it is a rare occasion to see someone there obviously drunk. Other than that bar and the predominantly gay gym I go to (how's that for an urban gay stereotype - sort of like the pot calling the kettle black!), I don't regularly patronize any gay (i.e. segregatedly gay) institutions. -- Rob Bernardo, San Francisco, California {nsc,ucbvax,decwrl,amd,fortune,zehntel}!dual!ptsfa!rob _^__ ~/ \_.\ _ ~/ \_\ ~/ \_________~/ ~/ /\ /\ _/ \ / \ _/ \ _/ \ \ /