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From: dubois@uwmacc.UUCP (Paul DuBois)
Newsgroups: net.origins
Subject: in Order to Order the Order
Message-ID: <1034@uwmacc.UUCP>
Date: Mon, 6-May-85 14:06:01 EDT
Article-I.D.: uwmacc.1034
Posted: Mon May  6 14:06:01 1985
Date-Received: Tue, 7-May-85 21:54:18 EDT
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Organization: UW-Madison Primate Center
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This article is being posted for Ray Miller

/* Written  2:35 am  May  3, 1985 by miller@uiucdcsb.Uiuc.ARPA in uiucdcsb:net.origins */
/* ---------- "in Order to Order the Order" ---------- */
On the subject of thermodynamics, Yosi Hoshen writes:

> Try an experiment:  take some
> water and freeze it in your refrigirator.  That water entropy
> will decrease (ice is more ordered than liquid water).  However,
> the enropy of its surrounding will increase!

Um, not quite right for what you want to demonstrate.  The problems arises from
the multiple definitions of the word "order".  Most of us (myself included in
SOR pamphlet #2) are quite sloppy with our terms in this instance.  Order can
mean "geometric regularity" (which in informational thermodynamics is *worse*
for the evolutionist since it carries no information content) or it can mean
"functional capability".  Complexity, not symmetry, is required.  Evolutionists
still have not demonstrated how, theoretically, codes capable of carrying
information (such as the DNA program) can arise spontaneously.  Indeed, every-
thing we know indicates that they will degenerate, not improve, with time and
mutations to the code sequences.  I close with a quote from the evolutionist
Hubert Yockey, in "A Calculation of the Probability of Spontaneous Biogenesis
by Information Theory," Journal of Theoretical Biology, Vol. 67, Aug. 1977,
p. 380:
"Attempts to relate the idea  of `order'  in  a  crystal with biological
organization or specificity must be regarded as a play on words which cannot
stand  careful  scrutiny.  Informational macromolecules  can code genetic
messages and therefore can carry information."

A. Ray Miller
Univ Illinois
/* End of text from uiucdcsb:net.origins */

-- 
                                                                    |
Paul DuBois     {allegra,ihnp4,seismo}!uwvax!uwmacc!dubois        --+--
                                                                    |
"The presence of weeds in the garden is not explained by            |
  saying that the gardener has not pulled them yet."