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From: coryb@tekecs.UUCP (Cory Barker)
Newsgroups: net.religion
Subject: Re: Pickin' bones with Mormans
Message-ID: <5300@tekecs.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 1-May-85 18:51:08 EDT
Article-I.D.: tekecs.5300
Posted: Wed May  1 18:51:08 1985
Date-Received: Fri, 3-May-85 04:22:31 EDT
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Organization: Tektronix, Wilsonville OR
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In response to a posting by Tony Martinez discussing how truth
is learned Rick Frey writes,
> active part in the procurement of truth.  They don't just sit around,
> reading and waiting for the Holy Spirit to hit them on the head, they
> "examined" the scriptures for themselves.

In a related article Ken Arndt writes,
> I believe Tony has made several serious errors in his thinking.  He eschews
> the use of 'books' as a source of truth but writes us to tell of it. ...

The two replies indicate that the authors understand Tony to be
stating that books, scripture, or whatever have no use in the search
for truth. I think that Tony is being misunderstood here.
He in fact states that study is an essential part of the process.
In a revelation to the Prophet Joseph Smith the Lord stated,

Behold, you have not understood; you have supposed that I would
give it unto you, when you took no thought save it was to ask me.
But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in you mind;
then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause
that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore you shall feel that
it is right.

Near the end of the Book of Mormon the Prophet Moroni states,

Behold, I would exhort you that when ye shall read these things, if
it be wisdom in God that ye should read them, that ye would remember
how merciful the Lord hath been unto the children of men, from the
creation of Adam even down until the time that ye shall receive these
things, and ponder it in your hearts.
And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye
would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these
things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with
real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of
it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

These passages are the best statement that I know of explaining
the Latter Day Saint belief on this subject.  They clearly point
out that we must study the things we are going to ask about before
we ask and I know that Tony understands this.

Rick Frey later poses a question,

> In your post you made the statement that truth comes only from a
> revalation from God and *not* from books.  But how do you deal with a
> book that claims to be a revalation from God?

A book may claim to be a revelation from God but I know of no other
way of knowing whether or not the book really is the true word of God
than the method that Tony and the above quotes specify.

Ken Arndt later continues,

> This is a standard Morman cop out when presured to account for passages of
> the bible that identify them as cursed - to use Paul's not nicy, nicy phrase.
> "I testify" they say on your doorstep.  What they mean is , "I ignore the 
> plain sense of scripture and accept the 'new scripture' from the hand of
> the angel to brother Smith.  I 'feel' that this is so.  After much looking

What is wrong with a person testifying about the things which the
Lord has revealed to them?  The way that I understand the Bible,
this is what Peter did in the 16th chapter of Matthew when he
testified that Jesus is the Christ.  Jesus then pointed out that
flesh and blood had not revealed this to him but his Father in
Heaven had.  When true testimony is borne by the power of the Holy
Ghost, those who have ears to hear will hear and know that the truth
is being spoken.

I testify that Jesus Christ suffered and died to provide all of us
the opportunity to be forgiven of our sins.  He was resurrected and
lives today.  I know that God the Father and Jesus Christ did in
reality appear to Joseph Smith and restored the Church of Jesus Christ
on the earth through him.  I know that both the Bible and the Book of
Mormon are true witnesses that Jesus is the Christ.  These things have
been revealed to me by the Holy Ghost and that is the way that I know
they are true.

Cory Barker