Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP
Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site rna.UUCP
Path: utzoo!linus!philabs!cmcl2!rna!dan
From: dan@rna.UUCP (Dan Ts'o)
Newsgroups: net.unix
Subject: Re: Problems with the 7300
Message-ID: <395@rna.UUCP>
Date: Mon, 13-May-85 14:53:18 EDT
Article-I.D.: rna.395
Posted: Mon May 13 14:53:18 1985
Date-Received: Thu, 16-May-85 03:01:35 EDT
References: <166@timeinc.UUCP> <1160@cbosgd.UUCP> <>
Reply-To: dan@rna.UUCP ( Ts'o)
Organization: Rockefeller Neurobiology, NYC
Lines: 40
Summary: 

In article <> greenber@timeinc.UUCP (Ross M. Greenberg) writes:
>>>AT&T claim 9 users.  Could be.  I felt it was *VERY*
>>>slow with one user.
>>
>>More specifically, the disk is slow, compared to the speed of everything
>>else.  CPU processes seem quite fast.  However, in a disk that small and
>>that inexpensive, you can't expect a lot of speed.
>>
>>	Mark
>Yes, I can expect a faster performing *machine* from AT&T.  If it isn't
>fast enough to do any practical work, then (whatever the reason) the
>machine just doesn't have the bang for the buck that I was hoping. 
>I mean, lets be serious: $7000 for a machine that requires over a minute
>for simultaneous logins on two terminals??? Now this machine only
>had 512K so there was a lot of swapping going on, but why would AT&T
>send an army (well, about eight people) to a Uni-Group meeting with
>machines that were configured as such toys *UNLESS* they actually
>consider that to be what people will buy.

	I was at the Uni-Group demo of the AT&T and this comment does not
match my impression. Yes, the disk was slow relative to what I am used to
(it has an 85ms access time, I don't know the transfer rate). But I thought
the machine was quite speedy. It is a virtual memory 10Mhz 68010. Nroff
for example, benchmarked at .6 of a 11/780 (Eagles, 4.2BSD). For the price
(which I think you have wrong, my impression is that with standard discounts
it will be in the $4000 range), I think it is not bad, especially considering
an okay window interface and integral phone modem.

	I believe that you were misled at the demo by trying to do
simultaneous logins on a loaded machine. Most of the time at the demo, the
7300's have ~6 active windows, each doing quite a lot of work such as
flashing digitized pictures, rotating figures, etc.

	I am not saying it is the greatest machine. The disk is definitely
a problem if you want use the 7300 as a typical multiuser UNIx machine. On
the other hand, the disk is probably fine for your average single user
business application. The windowing interface is a great step, but not quite
up to MacIntosh standards. I also hate green screens. But I think the machine
is worth considering, especially if (as someone else thought) the machine
might be available to some for $3000.