Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site unc.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!decvax!mcnc!unc!fsks From: fsks@unc.UUCP (Frank Silbermann) Newsgroups: net.flame Subject: Re: WW 2 Message-ID: <456@unc.UUCP> Date: Sun, 16-Jun-85 17:43:40 EDT Article-I.D.: unc.456 Posted: Sun Jun 16 17:43:40 1985 Date-Received: Tue, 18-Jun-85 04:19:49 EDT References: <667@dataio.UUCP> <5305@fortune.UUCP> Reply-To: fsks@unc.UUCP (Frank Silbermann) Organization: CS Dept., U. of N. Carolina at Chapel Hill Lines: 62 Summary: In article <667@dataio.UUCP> bright@dataio.UUCP (Walter Bright) writes: >>> Some points I feel need to be raised about all the discussion >>> about Reagan's Bitburg visit: >>> >>> Jews weren't the only ones in the concentration camps. Millions >>> of .... died in them too. In article frederic@ubvax.UUCP (Frederic Bach) writes: >I suppose that nobody really cares about communists dying in death >camps. After all, if they were good communists they could go and >die in the Gulag. Actually, this IS analogous to the Soviets' exterminations of anti-communists. Note that that the Soviets insisted that the anti-genocide resolution sponsored by UN must NOT denounce POLITICAL genocide. Which is why the US won't sign it. Unlike the case with the Jews, Gypsies, and many homosexuals, the communists had the opportunity to avoid punishment by "reforming". In fact, Hitler encouraged the Nazi party to accept (Aryan) ex-communists, on the grounds that a person who could be so idealistic (fanatic) to accept anything as radical as communism would make an excellent Nazi. >Of course, it doesn't really matter that 20 MILLION soviets >have also died during the war; it is probably Stalin's fault. Damn right! Stalin could have stopped Hitler before the Nazis gained strength, but the communists were hoping Russia could stay out of the war and let the non-communist nations destroy each other. Stalin pulled the same trick during the Warsaw ghetto uprising. Stalins troops sat on their hands while the Germans exterminated the last bastion of non-communist anti-Nazi resistance in Poland. Furthermore, most of the Russian losses were battlefield causalties, the result of the Soviets applying brute force instead of sound military tactics. Of course, they had no choice, since Stalin had previously executed most of the experienced military officers. Stalin had suspected they might still be loyal to Leon Trotsky, who was Lenin's RIGHTFUL heir. >Quite surprisingly, many of the Jews I know in France have been >communists as well. It IS surprising. The main reason Jews in Russia supported the Bolsheviks is that the Bolsheviks were the only political force that was not anti-Jew. Later it turned out that the communists planned to give Jews equality, NOT by giving Jews freedom, but rather by oppressing EVERYBODY equally. >Should they (Jewish communists) have died in the camps, would they have >been communist victims, or jewish victims? Depends on what it said on the arrest forms. >I am not a communist, I am just anti-anti-communist. That is like saying you are not a Nazi, but merely an anti-antiNazi. Face it. Of all the evil political forces of this century, Nazism is the worst. But Communism runs a not-too-distant second place. Even the fascism of Mussilini or Franco would be preferable. Frank Silbermann