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From: mms1646@acf4.UUCP (Michael M. Sykora)
Newsgroups: net.politics
Subject: Re: Discrimination and Affirmative Action (in hi-tech)
Message-ID: <1340186@acf4.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 12-Jun-85 15:13:00 EDT
Article-I.D.: acf4.1340186
Posted: Wed Jun 12 15:13:00 1985
Date-Received: Fri, 14-Jun-85 05:19:08 EDT
References: <593@ihu1h.UUCP>
Organization: New York University
Lines: 40

>/* carnes@gargoyle.UChicago.UUCP (Richard Carnes) /  3:15 pm  Jun 11, 1985 */

>>> In my everyday encounters with people, I treat women and blacks
>>> somewhat differently from white males, that is, my knowledge of a
>>> person's race or sex can and usually does affect my actions in some
>>> way.  Part of the reason for this difference is my knowledge that
>>> both groups suffer from deep-rooted and tenacious prejudices in our
>>> society, and that this is an important factor in the life of each
>>> individual woman or black.

>Clayton Cramer replies:

>> This used to be called "patronizing".  *I* treat everyone as an individual;
>> if I don't know someone, I treat them dependent on the circumstances.

>It's offensive to most netters when someone attributes to them
>beliefs and attitudes that they didn't express.  Cramer's response is
>just mud-slinging, like his repeated statements that affirmative
>action is "racism."  To patronize means to treat with a manner or air
>of condescending notice.  What I stated above was that my knowledge
>of a person's race or sex can influence my actions toward them.  (The
>same is true of everyone reading this:  I doubt that many netters are
>sex-blind in their dating and sex life.)

"Patronizing" may not be the appropriate term, but what you said implies
that you treat women differently because they have been oppressed.  I
suspect there are other reasons you treat women differently, as you say:
"I doubt that many netters are sex-blind in their dating and sex life."
It is clear that this is not what Clayton was talking about.

>What does Cramer mean by the phrase "treat everyone as an
>individual"?

I believe he means that people should be treated according to their
own deeds and what is done personally to them, rather than as representatives
of an ethnic, religious, etc. group.

>Richard Carnes

						Mike Sykora