Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP
Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2(pesnta.1.2) 9/5/84; site idsvax.UUCP
Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!bonnie!akgua!whuxlm!whuxl!houxm!ihnp4!pesnta!idsvax!steiny
From: steiny@idsvax.UUCP (Don Steiny)
Newsgroups: net.politics
Subject: Re: Re: Congratulations to the NRA
Message-ID: <171@idsvax.UUCP>
Date: Fri, 21-Jun-85 15:58:26 EDT
Article-I.D.: idsvax.171
Posted: Fri Jun 21 15:58:26 1985
Date-Received: Sun, 23-Jun-85 03:46:58 EDT
References: <484@gargoyle.UChicago.UUCP> <> <493@gargoyle.UChicago.UUCP>
Organization: Independent Consultant - C/UNIX, Natural Language
Lines: 43

>
> Let's be honest here.  It's not the "Wall Street Journal", that monolithic,
> faceless organization, is it?  It's really a guest opinion article by
> Don B. Kates, Jr. that you're quoting, right?
> 
> Don B. Kates, Jr. is a libertarian lawyer and pro-gun fanatic who 
> frequently invents statistics out of the air to support his views.  If
> you quote him, please identify the source of the statistics so we can
> verify them ourselves.
> 
> Jeff Shallit

	Jeff, I and others have posted the articles many times.  You
are correct, they are by Kates.   The only comeback you ever have to 
the articles is that you don't like Kates.  That is called an "ad homimum
fallacy" and does not contribute to your side of the argument at all.
You somehow think that the number of handgun deaths is an argument
against handguns, but you have never posted any material that
addresses the issues he raises.   For instance, what are 
people who live in rural areas without police protection
supposed to do to defend themselves?   Around here is not
uncommon for a deranged person to start roaming
the mountians killing people.   THE POLICE advise people
around here to get guns and learn how to use them.  
When a serious flood destroyed the roads to the mountians, cut off
power, and so on, there was AN INCIDENT of looting.  Once the word
got out armed citizens managed to stop the looting right away.
After reading Kates' articles, reading the paper, and talking to
the local police, I cannot even imagine what you must be
thinking with your avid, rabid, anti-gun stance.

	It seems to me that you hear the word "gun," your mind
shuts down and you start to play tapes of irrelavent statistics.
Don't forget that Kates has said that violent crime INCREASES
in areas with strick gun control and he cites the statistics to
back himself up.   When you do the research that he has and
can counter his statistics with RELEVANT statistics of your own,
I would be eager to read them.

pesnta!idsvax!steiny
Don Steiny - Computational Linguistics
109 Torrey Pine Terr.  Santa Cruz, Calif. 95060
(408) 425-0832