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From: rlr@pyuxd.UUCP (Rich Rosen)
Newsgroups: net.religion.christian
Subject: Re: Evidences for Religion (reposting)
Message-ID: <1264@pyuxd.UUCP>
Date: Sat, 20-Jul-85 13:11:45 EDT
Article-I.D.: pyuxd.1264
Posted: Sat Jul 20 13:11:45 1985
Date-Received: Mon, 22-Jul-85 06:30:00 EDT
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Organization: Whatever we're calling ourselves this week
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>>[Mike Huybensz]
>>Morality is an evolutionarily adaptive trait.  It can be a heuristic for
>>optimizing reproductive success.  Just like intelligence.

> You merely remove the question one level.  Why should evolutionary
> adaptiveness be valued?  Or survival?  (Again, I may agree that they
> *should be*, but why should I believe it, for reasons *you* can
> give?)  [DUBOIS]

>>Your example resolves simply in terms of game theory: kill a relative of
>>somebody and you are reducing the genetic fitness of the survivor.  Thus
>>it may pay to make standing threats against people who bump off your
>>relatives.  Making killing someone immoral is a shorthand that is simpler
>>to teach than game theory.

> Still presupposes the value of survival.  Which was the question!

If you don't like surviving, Paul, let my friend Stig, who works for the
Strongarm Collection Agency ("We have no slogan") help you out.  Think
about this:  those animals for whom survival was not a valued adaptive
trait?  Where are they now?  Why?  Get it?

Why survive?  Why value it?  Death IS kind of painful, and it would put an
end to all the things my personhood has come to value in life (your
presumptions about afterlife notwithstanding).  Thus, survival is valued.

You're right.  Maybe I do assume too much.  These are rather basic
assumptions I thought didn't have to be gone through at length.  If you
disagree with them, I'll send Stig over to your house if you like.  After
all, why value survival?  (Stig is a fictitious person, and is a trademark
of the Strongarm Collection Agency. Despite this, he can still do a job
on a delinquent creditor!)
-- 
"There!  I've run rings 'round you logically!"
"Oh, intercourse the penguin!"			Rich Rosen    ihnp4!pyuxd!rlr