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From: matt@brl-tgr.ARPA (Matthew Rosenblatt )
Newsgroups: net.religion.jewish
Subject: Re: Down to Brass Tacks
Message-ID: <167@brl-tgr.ARPA>
Date: Thu, 25-Jul-85 10:39:17 EDT
Article-I.D.: brl-tgr.167
Posted: Thu Jul 25 10:39:17 1985
Date-Received: Sat, 27-Jul-85 01:11:58 EDT
References: <11605@brl-tgr.ARPA> <1236@pyuxd.UUCP>
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Organization: Ballistic Research Lab
Lines: 43

> > 	The fact is that Orthodox Jews have not been forming kangaroo
> > Sanhedrins to try, condemn and execute gay people.  Did you hear of any
> > Orthodox Jews among the cops at the Stonewall?  Are there Chassidic
> > f*g-bashers?  Are Talmudists in black hats burning down gay bars on
> > Rehoboth Beach, Delaware?  Of course not.  [MATT ROSENBLATT]
> 
> I'm not sure what relevance this has.  Because Samet proclaimed that he's
> not really out to "bash fags", he's only out to threaten them enough to
> make them see HIS light, that's better than "fag-bashing"?  I don't think so.
> [RICH ROSEN]

	First of all, I don't read Mr. Samet as threatening anyone.  With
what is he threatening gays?  Divine punishment now?  YOU don't believe
that threat is any more real than threatening them with a voodoo curse,
and if a gay man believes it is real, he has probably already become
celibate.  Is Mr. Samet threatening them with human punishment?  That
cannot occur until the Sanhedrin is reconstituted, which cannot occur
until the Temple is rebuilt (b'karov, b'yamenu), which (according to
the majority opinion) cannot occur until the Messiah comes.  Until then,
the gays can enjoy.  So I see no threat.  

	Second, if I were gay, I would rather be threatened by a Yitzchok
Samet than bashed.  It sure _is_ better.

> > 	So the American people made an EXCEPTION to the free market in
> > order to help get whole groups of people out of residential and employment
> > ghettos.  This EXCEPTION puts the landlord or employer in America in the
> > same position as the tenant or worker in Russia or the Army -- he is FORCED
> > to house or employ someone against his will. [MATT ROSENBLATT]
> 
> Sorry, crude and very inappropriate analogy.  We are not talking about
> "exceptions to the free market", we are talking about human rights.  Human
> beings taking precedence over "free market economic rules".  (Good idea, no?)
> We are denying people the "right" to impinge on other people's rights of
> employment/housing/etc.  It ain't a "right" at all. [RICH ROSEN]
> 
	What "rights of employment/housing/etc."?  Who says a man has
any more right to compel an employer to hire him than the employer has
to compel a worker to work for him?  Who says a man has any more right
to compel a landlord to rent to him than the landlord has to compel a
tenant to rent from him?  As you say, "It ain't a 'right' at all."

					-- Matt Rosenblatt