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From: janec@tektools.UUCP (Jane Caputo)
Newsgroups: net.singles
Subject: Re: The Value of Chutzpa
Message-ID: <351@tektools.UUCP>
Date: Sat, 3-Aug-85 11:11:11 EDT
Article-I.D.: tektools.351
Posted: Sat Aug  3 11:11:11 1985
Date-Received: Tue, 6-Aug-85 08:35:52 EDT
References: <317@azure.UUCP> <800@vax2.fluke.UUCP>
Distribution: net
Organization: Tektronix, Beaverton OR
Lines: 79

Well, here I am on my soapbox again.  Sorry this got so long.

> Chris Andersen:
> >	First of all, you violated rule #1 of net.singles
> >	"Never assume that you know what turns MOTAS on".
> 
Thank you Chris.  If you want to know
what turns women on, ask them.  I know we keep harping on that,
but men in this group keep trying to speak for us.  What Gregg Mackenzie
called "the proper attitude" would certainly turn me off.  When I was
very young and sadly lacking in empathy, I considered it sort of a social 
responsibility to put down men who considered themselves god's gift to 
women.  My daughter does the same thing now.  I'll admit, we have probably 
been exposed to more of that nonsense than most young women (she's a 
restaurant hostess, I was a hatcheck girl at the time.)

Frank Silbermann:
> Furthermore, if a woman has a fetish for bold, swashbuckling men,
> and you refuse to strut for her, well, you're not being very considerate
> of her needs, are you?
> 
And what if she doesn't have a fetish for bold, swashbuckling men?  Your
strutting will turn her off immediately.

> Chris Andersen:
> >	Frankly, if a women dismisses a guy JUST because he can't say "hello"
> >	without stuttering a little (a condition resulting from several years
> >	of being a "wimp"), then perhaps the women isn't even worth the try.
> 
Frank:
> Sounds like sour grapes to me.

No, not sour grapes.  I think it's a little strong to say she "isn't worth 
the try."  But it's very realistic for someone like Chris, whose appeal is 
likely to be his sensitivity and warmth, to eliminate this woman.  There's
not likely to be much interest on either side.  

What a woman is attracted to has far more to do with her childhood than any
objective facts you could derive through cocktail party chatter: the dynamics
of her relationship with her father and other male images she absorbed at an
early age.  When I was growing up in a large family with a very busy father,
visiting his office was a great privilege.  It was one of the few ways I could
see him alone.  Later when I hit the classic preadolescent struggle with Mom 
for Dad's affection, the only chink in her armor was her resentment of his
work.  She refused to learn about it or discuss it, so of course I did.  Some
of my most satisfying acts of adolescent defiance were discussing zoning 
ordinances at the dinner table (how's that for a full-fledged nerd? :-) 

Today when I go to a party the men I'm interested in are conveniently in a 
corner, engrossed in some technical discussion.  They seldom recognize me,
but luckily I can recognize them.  Unless, of course, they go underground for
the evening, circulating and making smalltalk to meet women. . . 

Forgive me for belaboring this one (admittedly deviant) case, but the world 
is full of women with unique histories.  And each is looking for "somebody 
special" -- a man whose ways coincide with her half-conscious images of
masculinity.  When the fit is right, the most unexpected, insignificant 
things will turn her on (and the only techniques you'll need will be for 
self-defense :-)

If you are merely looking for a woman, then there probably are some standard
strategies that will help (though don't believe everything you read in the
how-to books.)  But if you want "somebody special", then the best thing you 
can do is learn to telegraph what you really are.  Be open about yourself. 
Make sure your public image matches your private one as closely as possible, 
and give the right woman a chance to find you while you're looking for her.  
If you feel the real you is too boring to attract anyone, think again.  
Think how exciting it is in the early stages of getting to know someone else,
finding out all the interesting things they've been hiding from the world.
Human beings are marvelous, complicated creatures.

Jane Caputo
{allegra, ihnp4, decvax, ucbvax...}!tektronix!tektools!janec

Tektronix, Inc.
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