Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site rochester.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!gamma!epsilon!zeta!sabre!petrus!bellcore!decvax!genrad!panda!talcott!harvard!seismo!rochester!ray From: ray@rochester.UUCP (Ray Frank) Newsgroups: net.abortion Subject: Re: Equal access to pleasure Message-ID: <11298@rochester.UUCP> Date: Sat, 31-Aug-85 06:31:03 EDT Article-I.D.: rocheste.11298 Posted: Sat Aug 31 06:31:03 1985 Date-Received: Sun, 1-Sep-85 13:28:55 EDT References: <661@ttidcc.UUCP> <14939@mgwess.UUCP> Organization: U. of Rochester, CS Dept. Lines: 84 > In article <11189@rochester.UUCP> ray@rochester.UUCP (Ray Frank) writes: > >> > >> No. Biological inequality is not an injustice. Social policy > >> can be unjust. The efforts of the Government to track down fathers > >> are simply insufficient or ineffective; just look at the rise in > >> single parent families headed by women. [...] > >> The fact, sir, is that unwanted pregnancies and children > >> have a cost, and that cost is borne by women, not as a consequence of > >> biology, but because of social policies. [...] > >> Marcel Simon > > > >To what degree should fathers be tracked down? > >Ever hear of one nignt stands (I call it mutual masturbation)? It happens to > >a great extent in women getting pregnant. You don't know each other and don't > >owe each other anything the next morning or at 4am when you part and go > >your seperate ways forever. No one should bear the responsiblily of your > >irresponsiblity, and that includes the male involved. Both of you entered > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > What about the male's responsibility? > > >into an unwritten aggreement at the bar or where ever you met. [...] > >[...] If the male gets VD, he has no recourse in terms of making > >the women pay for his treatment. If the women gets VD or gets pregnant she > >as well should have no recourse in making the male pay. > >It would seem silly if a women tracked down the father of her baby and stated > >that out of the dozens or more guys I've been with you are the father and now > >I want you to build your life around me, marry me, or pay for my abortion, or > >pay child support, built me a house, go to work everyday for the next 20 years > >and pay one quarter of your wages to me and your child, and all this because > >of 30 minutes of idle meaningless dribble in a bar and a hop in the sack. > >Not a very sound base with which to build a life on. > >If you play you must pay means YOU must pay not someone else. > > It seems that there are TWO (2) people 'playing' here. Why doesn't the > male PAY as well? > > >[...] (how the sex act could change your life, aids, herpes etc.) > >The point is that it is not always a pregnancy that alters one's life style. > >Or that someone can come around and make it all better, such as finding the > >father and making him pay. There are things in this life that only YOU are > >responsible for and only YOU will be made to pay the price for because your > >actions are in fact YOURS. On abortion, I don't believe that the fetus should > >be made to bear the responsiblilty of the actions of the mother by aborting it. > > WHY ARE ALL THESE ACTIONS THE "MOTHER'S"? 'THEY' decide to have sex, but > SHE made the decision and has to live with it. (how did they turn into she) > If you want to support the idea that sex is a gamble that the man can > (/should be able to) walk away from without any payment, and NO > responsibility, then let the woman do WHATEVER she feels is necessary > to handle the results. > > If these are your true feelings (and not just something to rouse the net) > then you are the type of pro-lifer who destroys the credibility of the > caring, hurting, truly worried about the sanctity of life, pro-lifers. > My posting was in response to another posting concerning the issue of tracking down fathers, not in response to the issue of abortion. I did briefly mention my views on abortion, but the text mainly covered my feelings on tracking down fathers as a result of 'enlightened' sexual encounters. By the way, is it clear that it can always be determined with certainty who the real father is? > I am PRO-CHOICE (and rabid on the subject) but I can understand (though > not support) those whose life-code (from whatever basis) makes them > feel abortion is wrong, wrong, wrong. The attitude displayed in your > posting is the classic "you made your bed you dirty slut now raise > your bastard yourself". This is in no way an attitude which will cut > down on abortion/unwanted pregnancy etc. > You said 'dirty slut' not me. Is this what you think of people who engage in loveless sex? > -- > > unixcorn (alias m. gould) > > "there's a unicorn in the garden and he's eating a lily" > gatech!dcc1!unixcorn *** REPLACE THIS LINE WITH YOUR MESSAGE *** What a hack job you've done on my posting. You completely edited out anything that I posted concerning the males responsiblity. Is this typical of people who are 'rabid' on the subjects being debated. You seem like an enlightened person, you must be for freedom of speech, why did you edit out the part about the males responsibility and then have the ignorance to ask the me about the males responsibility?